[quote=@TJByrum]I know it probably ain't much a big deal in other places, especially outside of America.  But I live in South Carolina, so naturally it seems like a pretty big deal to everyone here.  I just wanted to see what the intelligent folks here thought about the thing.  I'm sure you've seen this spread across the rest of the south, cause other states associate this flag as well.

Now when I say Confederate flag, I mean the flag used by the Army of Northern Virginia (and other groups) during the American Civil War ([url=http://www.usflag.org/historical/scross.gif]this one[/url], specifically, even though it ain't square).  It was a battle flag used by commanders, but everyone in the south generally associates it with the Confederacy overall, instead of the real one - which was similar [url=http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2013/05/19/opinion/19disunion-flag/19disunion-flag-blog427.jpg]to this[/url].[/quote]

I know you don't mean harm by this, but that all really just semantics. Which flag is 'real' or not.

Would you believe me if I said [i]both[/i] of those flags are the Confederate Flag? Both real, both wholly associated with the Confederacy and the men who fought to keep the right to own human beings? 

The Battleflag of North Virginia was the flag that was flown during the majority of the battles for the Civil War, because people were confused who was who when the Flag of the CSA was used during battles, since from a distance it was very similar to the Union flag. The Battleflag of North Virginia was the one the northerners, the buffalo soldiers, the slaves, the indians saw, and associated with the south. To me, that makes it just as real as any flag some guys in an office say is the 'real' Confederate flag.

Again, that's just linguistics, but I see the flag men carried and associated with the Confederacy as real as the Stars and Bars. 

[quote=@TJByrum]can't speak for its prevalence in other parts of the south.[/quote]

Atlanta here, so not """*~*"REAL"*~*""" south. We don't really see it here, you kind of get scoffed at if you make Confederate pride super obvious. Like, I'm all for states rights, but maybe don't wear the flag of the people who LITERALLY fought to keep my ancestors in chains.

[quote=@TJByrum]But what do [i]you [/i]think?[/quote]

I don't think it's possible to remove the negative associations from a flag. No matter how many people see it as the 'Southern Pride' Rebel there will still be people who positively associate it with the Rhodesian flag, or Apartheid South Africa, like the shooter.
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[quote=@mdk]People everywhere are flipping out that anyone who doesn't hate the confederate flag must be a racist. I don't get it. A cloth rectangle is a really stupid way to judge someone's character. To me, 'Confederate Flag = Racist' sounds exactly the same as 'Rainbow Flag = Sinner,' and I have no patience for either sentiment. Liberal America is about as well-equipped to talk about Southern pride as Christian America is to talk about gay pride..... I think the analogy holds up. 

Anyway.

If we're gonna hate people over history, we should start by tracking down everyone who's worn a Che Guevara shirt. Symbols only carry meaning when people attach it. If we could just, you know.... stop attaching the worst possible connotation to every possible symbol we don't like? That might clear a lot of things up.[/quote]

False equivalency brah. 

Gay people never succeed from the Union so they could sodomize people without their permission.

I agree with the El Che sentiment tho
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[quote=@TJByrum]It's about like saying we should remove all Christian crosses from the churches because they offend Atheists.[/quote]

It's really not.

[quote=@TJByrum]To many people associating the Rebel flag with racism because they're ignorant.[/quote]

No we associate it with racism because my great great grandmother literally remembers her father being dragged out of their home by Klansmen and the sons of Confederates and hung from a tree

Because they were then denied the vote by southerners who only freed them so they could throw down their lives for their masters

[quote=@TJByrum]Robert E Lee, one of the greatest generals of his time, fought for the south and he freed his slaves.[/quote]

What a paragon of humanity?

[quote=@TJByrum]The Union generals (even Ulysses Grant) owned slaves before, during, and even [i]after [/i]the Civil War.  Lincoln's Emancipation Proclamation freed slaves in the [i]south[/i], not the north.  By that logic, the American flag is racist.[/quote]

It is, homie.
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[quote=@Keyguyperson]
I think we should take it down and fly, you know, [i]the actual confederate flag[/i].

Flying a battle flag from Virginia over a memorial for Confederate soldiers in general is like flying only a British flag over a memorial for all the Allied soldiers that died in WWII.
[/quote]

Wait are you saying that flying the CSA battleflag over a peaceful memorial gives the wrong impression?

Nah that's silly, fam.