[quote=@Chrononaut] I don't view games as art, I view them as entertainment. I view games designed with the intention of being art as art, but most aren't. When a painter brings his brush to a canvas, he starts with the intention of creating art. That isn't to say that the intro of Bioshock 1 wasn't "artistic". It was barely interactive so all you were left with is some form of art. Aka it was an actually useless scene from a gameplay perspective, but there's that Oscar Wilde quote about art that goes "The only excuse for making a useless thing is that one admires it intensely". But the game design of shooting people in the face and electrocuting them wasn't created with the intention of art. It was created with the intention of creating an experience and not all experiences are art. Paintball, while it does have paint, wouldn't be considered an art form. That's why paintball and video games have the word "game" attached to them. What makes a fun experience can be subjective too though, so I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you. Edit: I suppose I dislike the notion of calling everything "art" because in the case of videogames the word has been attached only very recently to something that for most people is just "fun shooty/fighting/strategy" experiences. For the vast majority of gamers, games are a hobby to whittle away the hours. The same can be said of movies, but movie goers don't typically sit down for six hours at a time and then proceed to revolve their lifestyle around one single hobby. [/quote] I disagree. Video games don't constitute fine art, but I don't think the requirements for being art should be particularly specific. Fine art is the shit we frame, and hold above everything else as shining example of human achievement. The Mona Lisa, Citizen Cane, The Statue of Liberty, Don Quixote, Handel's Messiah, these constitute fine art. Video games don't have anything that don't meet that standard for no other reason but the format isn't respected enough at this point in its development. But art? That just means a creative achievement in general. Anything that has been given some sort of noticeable human creative touch. A car can be art. So can a store-bought product, or everything on deviant art. I would venture to say the RPG had never produced fine art, but everything we write here is art. All it takes is a conscious effort to make something aesthetic. There is no reason to disdain run-of-the-mill human creation because it hasn't reached the level of fine art. As for Movie goers not letting their lives revolve around movies, I think Star Wars would have something to say about that. On the other hand, most gamers just play games for a few hours and leave it at that in the exact same way most people watch movies.