[@Lucius Cypher] Makes sense it sounds like it; it's actually mentioned in there because DSP ported it to PF as Path of War. And since we don't have a wizard, I don't see the point in preventing anyone from taking something that's not even as good as one. Though I wouldn't, like they did, compare it to anime so much as video games, since it's basically identical to how skills work in Dragon Age for the warrior and rogue, what with there being their regular attack as normal, and then skills they can use. Yes, it's more "powerful" and versatile than base martial classes, but they're all basically just a weak (because magic is still stronger) magus with thematic differences that attempt to cover the weaknesses. It doesn't invalidate the core and base melee classes any more than having a wizard or sorcerer in the party does. [hider=What is Democ- Err...Martial Training?]Martial Training is just "pick one discipline, get a tiny number of things from it. Take this six times and hey, you used six feats to get a lesser version of something archetypes have already but significantly worse." It's the Eldritch Heritage equivalent, only not as powerful, and you have to take it more times to get anywhere close, with around the same requirements (16-17 in whatever ability score minimum, and either take a useless skill X times (depending which level of the feat it is) or use your BAB (which actually makes fighters worthwhile)).[/hider][hider]How would I use it?]IF I WENT WITH IT, here's a summary of what I'd do at each level (because I plan this all out way ahead; I have most of this character's future already planned, with or without this, and note that I do not have animus to augment these, so what I get is the base ability only, and the listed initiator level is assuming Int doesn't increase): Martial Training I (Level 3, assuming I have 3 ranks of Knowledge (Martial) by then. Initiator level 3.): Choose Elemental Flux discipline, get Spellcraft as a class skill, and use Intelligence as the initiation modifier (used in several abilities, but also, with this feat, affects your initiator level, which is 1/2 level + Init Mod, with a maximum of your current level. So with my Int of 18, the +4 bonus means at level 20, I'll count as level 14 (and until level 8, initiator level = level)). I gain the ability to switch between active elements (there's a monk archetype from Paizo that does this, too. They're pretty badass) with elemental flux (standard action to switch elements), which for this discipline affects my damage type and has different effects for different maneuvers and stances (swift action to enter a stance, and they work like styles, but have to take a feat to use both a stance and a style, and can never be in more than once stance at a time obviously). I can recover maneuvers by spending a standard action to recover one maneuver (all martial initiator classes can do this, but they also have much more useful methods to recover a lot more). I'd take [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/elemental-flux-maneuvers#TOC-Fluctuation-Movement]Fluctuation Movements[/url] and [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/elemental-flux-maneuvers#TOC-Variable-Flux]Variable Flux[/url]. At this level, I can only ready one of my two maneuvers (meaning either spending 10 minutes to switch to the other one being readied, or a standard action to recover each time I use whichever one I have readied). Martial Training II (Level 5. Initiator level 5.): I'd take [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/elemental-flux-maneuvers#TOC-Elemental-Strike]Elemental Strike[/url], [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/elemental-flux-maneuvers#TOC-Arcane-Shield]Arcane Shield[/url], and [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/elemental-flux-maneuvers#TOC-Elemental-Nimbus]Elemental Nimbus[/url]. At this level, I can now ready two of my four maneuvers. Martial Training III (Level 7. Initiator level 7.): [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/elemental-flux-maneuvers#TOC-Lance-of-Power]Lance of Power[/url] and [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/elemental-flux-maneuvers#TOC-Elemental-Flux-Stance]Elemental Flux Stance[/url]. I wouldn't trade any of my maneuvers at this level (I like the level 1 ones better than the level 2 ones). At this level, I can ready three of my five maneuvers. Martial Training IV (Level 9. Initiator Level 8.): [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/elemental-flux-maneuvers#TOC-Eldritch-Consumption]Eldritch Consumption[/url] and [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/elemental-flux-maneuvers#TOC-Assay-Resistance]Assay Resistance[/url]. At this level, I can ready four of my seven maneuvers. Martial Training V (Level 11. Initiator Level 9.): [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/elemental-flux-maneuvers#TOC-Elemental-Absorption]Elemental Absorption[/url] and [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/elemental-flux-maneuvers#TOC-Enter-the-Vortex]Enter the Vortex[/url] (Note that I can't use maneuvers with the attack this stance lets me use). I would replace Variable Flux with [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/elemental-flux-maneuvers#TOC-Arcane-Torrent]Arcane Torrent[/url]. At this level, I can ready five of my eight maneuvers. Martial Training VI (Level 13. Initiator Level 10.): At this point, I do not qualify for the levels of maneuvers this grants (well, the maximum levels, anyway) without increasing my Intelligence on two of levels 4, 8, and 12. Without doing so, I wouldn't take this level of the feat. I probably still won't take it because more than half my feats is kinda a silly use, ja?[/hider][hider=Some other stuff]If I don't go with everything I already have planned for the character, may variant multiclass something AND do Martial Training. So...no feats, but plenty of weak class features I could probably have better versions of just by doing regular multiclass. Even without VMC'ing, it would make me the group magus, basically. Although while I was doing this, my brain was like "five levels of this is just variant multiclass, if I did it at levels 3, 7, 11, 15, and 19." Also, looking over what I have, there are some feats I already have that I don't want to get rid of. May only do 4 levels of it, and use BAB instead of the skill (meaning minimum levels of 4, 7, 10, 12, 15, and 18, respectively, for the six feats, and with them being feats, that's 5, 7, 11, 13, 15, and 19, and may take them later than that)[/hider] [hider=Some EXTRA stuff edited in (PAY ATTENTION~ This is more important!)]I hadn't really looked at higher levels of Elemental Flux. Based on what I saw though, I will concede that that particular one may be too powerful. Therefore, I will go with [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/cursed-razor-maneuvers]Cursed Razor[/url] discipline if I do it, in which case (listing planned level to take the feats and what effective Initiator Level my character will be without the Intelligence increases): Martial Training I (Level 5, IL 5) -Spellcraft (Int). Same as Elemental Flux in that regard. No active element (surprise~ ^~^). Discipline weapons (which I forgot to mention in the other thing, and they give +2 to DCs for maneuvers that require them) are heavy blades, light blades, and spears. Feat gives 2 maneuvers, for which I would choose [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/cursed-razor-maneuvers#TOC-Luck-Shifting]Luck Shifting[/url] and [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/cursed-razor-maneuvers#TOC-Stutter-Strike]Stutter Strike[/url]. I would primarily ready Stutter Strike. Martial Training II (Level 7, IL 7) -Feat gives 2 maneuvers and a stance, both up to level 2 (note: there are no level 2 stances in any discipline. Just found that amusing). I plan on taking [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/cursed-razor-maneuvers#TOC-Mockery]Mockery[/url] and [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/cursed-razor-maneuvers#TOC-Word-of-Retribution]Word of Retribution[/url] for maneuvers (and keep stutter strike and word of retribution readied), and for stance: [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/cursed-razor-maneuvers#TOC-Aura-of-Misfortune]Aura of Misfortune[/url] (to help everyone else out). Martial Training III (Level 13, IL 10) -Feat gives a maneuver and a stance of up to 3rd level, and the option to switch out any maneuver for another maneuver of up to level 2. I would take [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/cursed-razor-maneuvers#TOC-Dogpile-Strike]Dogpile Strike[/url] and [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/cursed-razor-maneuvers#TOC-Touch-of-the-Witch]Touch of the Witch[/url] (-gasp-, NOT the third level one?! No. Because the third level one does nothing for me with only one curse strike). I would switch out Luck Shifting for [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/cursed-razor-maneuvers#TOC-Bad-Karma]Bad Karma[/url]. From here on, I would prepare Dogpile Strike, Mockery, and Word of Retribution, and primarily be in Touch of the Witch stance. Martial Training IV (Level 15, IL 11) -Feat gives two maneuvers of up to 4th level. I would take [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/cursed-razor-maneuvers#TOC-Persecution]Persecution[/url] and [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/cursed-razor-maneuvers#TOC-Warlock-s-Stride]Warlock's Stride[/url]. From here on, Aura of Misfortune for stance. Maneuvers prepared most of the time will be the same as before, plus Warlock's Stride. Martial Training V (Level 17, IL 12) -Feat gives two maneuvers, or one maneuver and one stance, of up to 5th level, and gives the option to switch out any maneuver for a maneuver of up to 4th level. I would take [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/cursed-razor-maneuvers#TOC-Aura-of-Shared-Misery]Aura of Shared Misery[/url] (the third level stance I skipped before) and [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/cursed-razor-maneuvers#TOC-Shadow-Pin]Shadow Pin[/url]. Again, same as before for main maneuvers readied but with Shadow Pin. I would use the new stance primarily (but occasionally switch it out for the others, MAYBE). Martial Training VI (Level 19, IL 13) -Feat gives two maneuvers, or one maneuver and one stance, of up to 6th level, and gives the option to switch out any maneuver for a maneuver of up to 5th level. I would take [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/cursed-razor-maneuvers#TOC-Eye-for-an-Eye]Eye for an Eye[/url] and [url=http://www.d20pfsrd.com/path-of-war/disciplines-and-maneuvers/cursed-razor-maneuvers#TOC-Oathbreaker-s-Aura]Oathbreaker's Aura[/url] stance. I'd not switch out maneuvers. From now own, the readied maneuvers would again be the same, but with Eye for an Eye, and would likely stay with Oathbreaker's Aura. That last stance in Elemental Flux pretty much killed it for me. ^//^[/hider]Plus, character of choice: [url=http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheet.html#id=496912]Anne Deverin, Human, Rogue, mixes chemicals, tries to emulate what Ciara does, has no idea whatsoever what Ciara does[/url].