Just to state now, I logging off after I make this post. [quote=Shy] A sexual act is usually in reference to things such as lustful kissing (virtually eating each other's faces off), sexual intercourse (regular or anal), as well as oral and "heavy petting." If it is anything along those lines then it is most likely considered a sexual act that should not be engaged in outside of marriage.I'll come back to the marriage thing in a minute. [/quote] Ok, glad we had that clarified in advance though. Means less confusion later on. [quote=ActRaiserTheReturned] Okay well allegedly, homosexuality is far more dangerous as far as STD's go than heterosexuality. But as for attraction, it's not a sin to just be attracted to the same sex. It is, however, a sin to have lustful attraction, filling your head with pornographic thoughts (Just like heterosexuality), etcetera. But I'll note, I'm not talking about Ex-Gay Therapy, necessarily, that is, in regards to Jesus changing a sinner. I think that the Ex-Gay type of ministry has it's place, but I"m more or less saying that God can do anything if he wanted. If he wanted to change us into a cat, he could. If he wanted to change us from a gay person to a straight person, he could. But the Bible specifically states that as far as our sin nature goes, God's will is to do anything to change us from our sinful state to a place that's closer to God. It doesn't matter how intrinsic to someone's being it is. So even when it comes to your sexuality, God, can change you. [/quote] I knew you meant in terms of God Healing, no worries there. Also, I should probably ask now. Do you even feel like continuing this? We seem to be circular. [quote=mdk]whoa whoah whoah. Not rape. Let's be firm on that point. Slavery existed, yes, as it did in every society (the Hebrew people were themselves slaves, and descendants of slaves, and found themselves enslaved periodically throughout the course of the scripture). Slaves of Israel were treated pretty well, including codified release and freedom (you've probably heard of the 'year of jubilee' if you've read up on the subject), and the poor (for instance, recently-freed slaves) were provided for under Abrahamic law (research 'gleaning' if you're interested). As for the sexism, well, that's a debate. Like I said before, we've been changing and evolving and growing ever since we were made, and the circumstances have changed. Fortunately the 'New Covenant' you read about is not like the old; it's not 'follow these rules and you will be pure,' it's 'follow Jesus and you will be forgiven.' [/quote] [url=http://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/Bible-Verses-About-Rape/]Bible supporting Rape[/url] Not trying to claim you're like this in the slightest just to clarify. But when it's claim the Bible doesn't have ______ when it does, I have a tendency to point out where it actually does. [quote=mdk] Is that your 'scientific' opinion? Have you made no assumptions, have you adapted your theories, have you abandoned your pre-existing claims?[/quote] I've adapted and changed claims before, such as when I left Christianity. As for assumptions, I would assume you mean "The Bible = Christianity" claim. But I just don't see anything it could be based on if not the Bible, there's nothing else really supporting it. [quote=mdk]I never said 'THE BIBLE ISN'T RELEVANT TO THE RELIGION.' In fact I gave you a specific verse quite to the contrary. So you can see why I'm a bit flippant on that last quote, and on this one -- if you're claiming (as you should) that science and reason are the only ways to approach the truth then why, with Christianity, do you instead rely on your prejudice (and your google, if you're holding to the stereotype)? Just as experiments need to be done under control, with honest and scrupulous observation, so must the Bible be read in good faith. Where we come from is always going to be an aspect of where we are. Hopefully I've cleared up the misunderstanding, and no harm done. I met a Christian once who argued that rock and roll was satan worship (OKAY, MORE THAN ONCE). We've got some loonies, that's for damn sure. Anyway being open is cool, I'll tell you what I can, we can talk at length and have fun. .[/quote] Sorry then. I was more just trying to cover possible claims or responses I've heard before in advance in an attempt to spare us a few posts. With Christianity it's a matter of it's a claim of something existing (God) which needs evidence to prove itself. Science always gives proof it's claims, but Christianity hasn't given the proof needed for God. As for read it in Good faith, that still won't change the fact the Bible may have a confliction, or support horrible crimes being committed. And there is no harm done, I'm just making my stance on the issue currently clear ahead of time.