[quote=@Inkarnate]
Also, this has been covered many times over and I won’t get into it. But the music is [i]blunt[/i] for various different reasons. Original hip hop auteurs did not intend to glorify the life of the inner city, as much is clear from Tupac’s early body of work as well as Public Enemy and before them Grandmaster Flash & The Furious Five. The point wasn’t that saying “fuck” or other expletives was intelligent because of the fact it was stated from the inner city but rather some of the most intelligent and artistic work that is [i]meaningful[/i] has come from hip hop musicians who have been blunt and liberal with their language. I’ve already mentioned Public Enemy, but there are many many others. It seems you read my sentence yet don’t actually comprehend the point I’m explaining, it’s really quite frustrating.
[/quote]

*Sigh* Liberal with language would mean the opposite of what your trying to argue. If it's suppose to be a bunch of simple and concise points, conservative is the word you're looking for. I know exactly what you're saying, I just don't agree. People can have different opinion and both not be wrong. :/ But I'll say I have about the same opinion of your argument as you do mine.

[quote=@Inkarnate]
Hip hop is the [i]language[/i] of the inner city, the byproduct of lower class breaking out and expressing themselves. If a few words offend you, then hip hop [or punk rock, for that matter] is not the type of art you should try to appreciate as you already have convictions and ideals going in. If you are going into something with presumptions and biases, you shouldn’t waste your time because you are going to perceive it incorrectly and use individual ignorance as foundation for how you view music that the individual would not understand. To understand you do not elevate your prejudices on a piece of art, it is foolish to do so.
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You're saying, if I can't stand language I shouldn't listen to music. A pointless and worthless jab, because this started from someone ELSE asking for no language, which I provided with minimal problem/effort. I did what he asked for and didn't flip him off and say. "This is so smart, fuck you." No, I have zero problem with cursing or immaturity in music, or mainstream artists (I've already said that, but will say it again.) But I'm not blind to how that appears to the people that dislike that stuff. Also I literally lived in the ghetto...but arguing if nigga really needs to be used 100 times in a song and about trends that really should die. I'd be getting in the weeds. Once again, it feels like your trying to close someone off. (because you are.) If someone didn't like "screamo" and thought that was metal in a nutshell, I wouldn't tell them they don't get it and tell them how important the harsh vocals are and how skillful it actually is...and just fucking show them metal that has none of it and is still perfectly good. I've found plenty of rap artists, I do like perfectly well. If I followed your rules for music, I wouldn't of listened to so much music...

[quote=@Inkarnate]
Like when I countered your whole argument that Kendrick Lamar does not have technical ability [which you suggested by saying he's outright bad?
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By posting a few songs, would of helped posting the actual lyrics and why those are particularly strong lyrics, because the lines I saw weren't impressive to me...and I never saw anything tell me why anything I posted was worse in quality? I know lyrics only a part of the puzzle but it is the most important piece of rap. Also ability to do something doesn't mean they are fulfilling that potential. Like a lot of pop singers...but I suppose that's opinion and won't say otherwise either way.

[quote=@Inkarnate]
or do you mean when both myself and Fabricant countered the point on elaborating on how Kendrick is a good storyteller and producer? Because that happened as well. We provided examples and explanations. Kendrick isn’t the most cerebral or even the most technical rapper, but he is not without his merits. This was the framework of Fabricant’s [and my own, to a lesser extent] argument; that Kendrick has a good amount of technicality, diction, storytelling ability, and compositional integrity. 
[/quote]

Ooooo, the producer thing always kills me. The beats really shouldn't be why you love the rapper. Because rappers almost never make their own music. Ever. He also apparently has like 20 goddamn writers for his lyrics too...o.o So now I ask, how much of the stuff he wrote that you all adore, is shit that he actually wrote? Seriously 4 producers and 6 writers on one song...I think Wikipedia just gave me a whole new distaste that it took 6 people to write some of these songs...