[quote=@Bishop] Wait, what? XDDD And furthermore, I don't want to debate if God exists or not. I'm certain that if it wasn't all elaborately planned with Jesus as a master conman and the disciples as highly intelligent fanatic that sold their stories very well, it could have also been someone sent from the future who spread these teachings in order to change the course of history in this world. If God was really another being, it could as well have been a highly intelligent and manipulative extraterrestrial being, or even an unknown force of the universe. Doesn't really matter. What bothers me most is your irrational belief that according to the bible's consistency, His words are true. He is omnipotent, to deceive, to lie to our race, it isn't beyond Him. By saying that he only speaks the truth and only wants the best for us, limits him in that aspect. It's super annoying since you describe him as omnipotent, capable of anything but somehow know his true nature and that he only leans on the good side. There isn't a side to Him. He is and has everything. We are made in his image no? Us suddenly going corrupt isn't just [b]US[/b] defecting. That corruption is a part of him since [b]HE IS EVERYTHING[/b]! Yes, from the consistency of the bible we can deduce and hope that God is as depicted. But seriously, just...think about it. We are humans who can't even begin to understand the concept of God's true form, do you [b]REALLY THINK[/b] that just by simple logical deduction, you can discern God's true nature and the truthfulness of His words? Here I am taking a stand like God exists. And it annoys the living crap out of me that people think they know that God really wants what is "good" for us. His true objectives could be different. The words He said to the prophets, are dumbed waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay down so that our simple minds can understand, that is, if he even talked to them. Do you really think that those exact words are his true intentions, all that he meant? He probably didn't even talk to the prophets. HE SHOWED THEM. He showed his true wanting to them so that they understood. Their being as a whole knew what He wanted. We can't even begin to understand the concept of how That being thinks or works or what It wants. Now what the prophets say are his words, are the best that they can describe what they felt when he showed them. This is how my ignorant self views this matter. Think about that for a moment. I'm sorry but you, the human race as a whole, is ignorant of everything about the universe. The small part that we know can't even begin to describe the amount that is left to explore, the new properties of everything else. Ruling out aliens and creatures like that is...well it annoys me to say the least. You think aliens as from the movies. Aliens are another being not from this Earth. They could be from another universe, they could be creatures made of pure energy that live on higher dimensions and influence our world in ways we can;t imagine and yet, God couldn't be such a creature because....??? You think simple and the most practical solution to something is the most probable? When we haven't even discovered the secrets of our own earth let alone the universe, you rule out everything else because the Bible covers everything and every question leaving no loopholes? Meta has a better way of putting it as seen in the first sentence. Forgive my by-the-word-increasing-ignorance, but what's the difference between all powerful and doing anything? Didn't He make the universe? Does He even need to look outside of Himself for sustenance? Doesn't that make him able to do everything? I mean lying is like, at the very bottom of things he is allowed to do. If we can lie, and He is everything, he also can lie. [/quote] Most of your points do not pass either Occam's Razor or Newton's Flaming Laser Sword (yes, that's entirely a thing and yes, logicians and philosophers use it), and though I have replies for each, like I said, I don't have time to debate. if I am going to be taken to an undisclosed location tomorrow I might as well pack for it with the packing list they gave me