[quote=@SleepingSilence]
[@Vilageidiotx]
[quote]Was just pointing out that innovation and good ideas are rewarded in the market. And if potato salad can somehow be funded...why does the government need to spend so much damn money themselves? (of others money.) This is a less serious point. 

But, my main hang up will always be government subsides and bailouts. They should not exist, nothing is 'too big to fail', it leads to price increases and many bad things...

It's never 'worth' it. And really for how much we have wasted, it's getting into the sunk cost fallacy at this rate.[/quote]

I'm not saying the market has no utility at all, I'm saying that the market isn't designed for long-term research on its own and requires subsdidy to work. The market is one tool, not the entire tool kit.

Also, I dislike the shit out of bailouts too, and I think shit like the Auto industry bailout was unnecessary (though politically useful I'm sure). I also think the bankers being rewarded was a despicable injustice and the bankers themselves who drove the housing collapse should have been booted into abject poverty for what they pulled. But I do have to say that the bank bailout itself was neccessary. Without it, the entire financial system would have caved in completely. That is insanely dangerous, especially in an economy as financialized as ours, and one where we rely on so much specialization that makes returning from a full depression very difficult.

[quote]
Uh, she's called African-American youth superpredators before...and all of Trump supporters deplorable people. So um, wouldn't exactly put it past her? I don't know why it's worth defending.[/quote]

You can draw some fucked up quotes from the other guy too (lord knows we've heard them enough to not need repeat them). Point being that the black and white "All Dems are feminist cucks and all Reps are MAGA" is over simplistic.

[quote]Don't worry I'm lazy too. xP (the rich people thing)
[/quote]

http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/Corporate-Profit-Margins-and-Employee-Compensation-Q2.gif

This belies the argument in those articles that capitalists aren't being allowed to create jobs by an evil government that is regulating them to death. Such a world would be one where profit follows wages downward. What we've seen instead is a capitalism that has been able to cut workers out. Neo-Liberalism hasn't helped - it has destroyed the labor movements, weakened mid twentieth century regulation on the financial system so people can play unsustainable games with money, and as a result wages are fucked. Personally, I suspect that automation has done a big part of this too; [url=https://systemicdisorder.files.wordpress.com/2014/09/productivity-chart-1948-2013.png]we see that productivity hasn't suffered[/url]. Automation isn't so much about replacing all jobs as it is about driving down the cost of labor, which breaks the traditional capitalist relationship because the only way labor can participate in an idealistic market system is through labor, and anything that slows down that damages wealth access among the majority (giving us that annoying media trend that is "why r millenials not spending?")

This is to say again that the market system is not God. It doesn't fix all problems and answer every situation perfectly. It's as much an imperfect institution as any other. And it can, of course, change depending on the circumstances. 

[quote=@SleepingSilence]
[@POOHEAD189] He gave him a million bucks. I think Trump has made a pretty good returns in that investment. xP

I mean almost all small business owners get loans...I don't see why that's put against him. 

I feel like I'm defending a man, who I'd probably be perfectly fine mocking under most circumstances...I just feel like, he's already gotten his 8 years of bush hatred out, without a year in office. And a lot of it isn't well justified either. 

[/quote]

Ehh... he was also President of his father's business and had his father's business contacts and, of course, name. He didn't branch into a new industry to make his billions. Shit, he didn't even branch into a new city. He just went to a different borough of NYC. 

The point isn't that he is evil for having been an aristocrat. The point is that he is an aristocrat, not a self made man. 

[quote=@SleepingSilence]
[@Andreyich] You said you want all Chinese to move out. I called it racism. Something you called yourself, then changed your mind. And you flipped me off. I'm pretty sure nothing else can be gained from this discussion. :P

So yes, you unironically calling yourself an edgelord and saying you get radicalized like you'll become a white terrorist and being unnecessarily hostile when I really wasn't. Yeah. You are a strawman that is apparently real.
[/quote]

Like I said, you guys have your own demons too, politics ain't "Left is all bad right is all good." 


[quote=@SleepingSilence]
And I agreed with that sentiment too. But I do think there's more that people could unite on, that politics current game is to be as unbearable and toxic as possible. Making middle ground only seem more impossible, but even attempting to be civil would be a nice change.
[/quote]

Eh, aside from the Estonian kid flipping your off, we're doing a pretty good job here.

And really, this is common politics on the ground. Not everybody following politics is an SJW or a White Nationalist. Most of us on both sides are just regular motherfuckers going to work and about our business.