[quote=@Etcetera] Your facts are incorrect. It was built from the ground up by a team comprised of people who originally made fan games and were really good at it. Advance games are super mediocre. Mania 2 is what everyone is asking for and not confirmed. But everything in business is a cash grab; that's how it works. And that's fine, because Mania 2 is as much a cash grab as Sonic 2 was. If you have something that works, make more. I enjoyed the orbs. But they [i]did[/i] do something new and better; that's why you have the emerald race now. The orbs are just for bonus points and whatever those medals are. 3D games were very buggy, but it's not that they weren't given a chance. People love the Sonic Adventure games because they're quality games. But then Sega started putting stupid time caps on Sonic games and ruined them with low quality, rushed products. It's not to say that they can't—Generations and Colors we're both great games (although in a way used 2D as a crutch), so it proves they can do it. But with modern 3D games, they just end up with Boost gameplay, which is getting to the point of becoming boost to win. Eh, S3&K is better than almost all fan games. You have a point, but that highlights how fans are so sick of Sega not doing their job, they're willing to do it for them. Some of the best 3D Sonic games are fanmade too, so that says something more about fans than the inherent quality of the games. The Sonic canon has never been consistent. It doesn't need to be; just have distinct lines of canon (or none outside of each individual game if it's that hard). They haven't even [i]done[/i] standalone 2D since the Advance games, unless you count Colors DS, which was also fantastic—it's 3D games that rely on 2D for bonus points and not the other way around. There's also a reason for that—Boost has you going so fast they literally cannot model a full 10 hour game in any reasonable time period; that's why Forces is doing the same thing (which I agree is kind of annoying since 2D Sonic and 3D Sonic don't mesh that well, in gameplay or as characters). My problem with the Advance games is how much looser the controls are compared to the Genesis games. Sonic 4 was trash, no argument there for 2D. Mania's erasing that from the continuation of the main line to become the true sequel to S3&K anyway. S4 has no controls to speak of and the slowest gameplay. [/quote] The Adventure games WEREN'T quality games. They had quality levels. Noooo way. And Knuckles is horrid if you compare it to some of the fan games out there. The best part about it was the Hyper Emeralds and even then the game doesn't hold any better than most fan games. 4, Rush, Rush Adventure, Rivals, Rivals 2... They've already re-released the first X games twenty times for every system available, they don't need to rehash them again in Mania when they could be going forward. Literally the only excuse is that it seems to be plot-sensitive instead of just "oh we're going back here cause nostalgia!" There WERE distinct lines of canon until Generations fucked it up by trying to cross them, that's the [i]point.[/i] The slowest gameplay have you PLAYED 2? The first three thousand hours are slow as fuck until you memorize speed run strats. They would be better off making a new Chronicles game than revisiting the first three games over and over. At least then the game worlds would expand some. WHY THE FUCK IS FORCES MELTING 2D INTO A 3D GAME AGAIN THERE IS NO EXCUSE THEY'VE ALREADY PLACATED THE PEOPLE ONLY INTERESTED IN SPEEDRUNNING MARIO WITH MANIA