[quote=@catchamber][@mdk] The analogy doesn't parallel the relationship between God and their creation, because God created everything. An accurate parallel would be a scenario where a gardener created a tree and its environment from nothing. [/quote] You're changing it up on me again. A minute ago this was about creation AND omniscience overriding free will, now it's supposed to be a God allegory. Alright. Treebert starts a class in his greenhouse, teaching people gardening. Treebert knows it all, I mean take it to whatever logical extreme you need in order to satisfy your *ahem* latest requirement. And in this greenhouse, he has total control over every environmental factor -- again, whatever logical extreme you need. Instead of looking at the trees, let's look at the students. Now, we've established that Treebert can nurture one hell of a tree, but these students, well, they're all types. Some of them have that green thumb, some don't. Treebert's advice to all of them is the same -- and it's, I mean, it's coming from Treebert, it's pretty good advice, the guy knows trees, he [i]literally[/i] wrote the book and passed it out to all the class. The book tells you exactly what you need to do to help your tree grow. Each student gets genetically-engineered Treebert seeds, and they get to use his greenhouse gadgets to [i]pretty much[/i] control their tree's environment (they're all in the same greenhouse, so there's some overlap with temp and whatnot), and they've got the guidebook that flat-out tells them how to do everything to grow a tree. Do his students have "free will" in this scenario? Bear in mind, Treebert wrote the curriculum, wrote the book, and owns the greenhouse and the trees, and if he wanted to, he could step in and take over the gardening duties.