Reflex was walking through the halls when he saw joker. "new plan" he said and exlained it to him. Joker grinned and went off to find bane. "reflex has a new plan. were going to capture both nightwing and batgirl, bring them to two different locations that are pretty far from each other and tell the bat to choose who hes going to save. if he doesnt make it to either place in either 15 or 20 minutes they both die, if he makes it one of them is safe, and that would leave only two problems to deal with. Then well take the other two out from there. Reflex said something about drowning them unconcious or something so they wont fight back, but i think waterboarding is a much better idea" Joker explained, shrugging when it came to the part about water boarding.