[quote=So Boerd]
Not wanting to derail the suicide thread, let's talk minimum wage here. Why shouldn't someone be allowed to offer their own services at three dollars an hour willingly?
[/quote]

Because then corporations would hire the cheapest labour possible, degrading the standard of living to hilariously awful levels all the while accumulating mass profits until they end up cutting each other too low and invariable collapse when nobody is able to purchase anything.

Seems pretty simple in concept to me. Now what exactly minimum wage should be set at is a different debate with several dynamics, that vary based on the country you live in and the times at hand. (ex: Sometimes it's appropriate to increase minimum wage--sometimes it isn't, and I'm sure there are rare occasions where it would be appropriate to decrease minimum wage.)

[quote=So Boerd]
Wait wait wait, so you think there will be enough who will offer to work for less that the whole labor force is screwed? It is my body. If I can kill myself, why can't I work for too little?
[/quote]

... [i]You're totally insane[/i]. No I'm serious. Go see a psychiatric professional if you seriously believe this kind of logic makes any sense.

We have a minimum wage because it benefits the overall population. It's the same reason we have laws. Yes, a person could work for a lower wage than minimum, and it actually does happen, but look at all the countries which have obscenely low minimum wages, or none at all--they tend to be shit. Like we're talking massive shit, people dying of diseases we figured out solutions for here a loooong ass time ago.

It's all about balance. It's the same reason why I don't run out and go "LETS LET EVERYONE KILL THEMSELVES!" Because that would be extreme and stupid and not address the many dynamics of suicide: Like if they aren't of sound mind, the mother versus the elderly dying in the hospital, and so on.

No real issue can be broad brush stroked with one sentence. It's the reason why most bills in congress are so insanely long: They're covering every possible outcome, and every possible situation, that they can possible envision.

Yes, there would be people who would work below minimum wage, yes, there are people that do that now, and yes, their lives are [i]absolutely terrible[/i], pretty much universally. Ergo, it benefits society to set a minimum wage to prevent abuse against the desperate and the naive. At what level that should be set is not something I can tell you as fact: I'm not an economist, I only know the basics of how the economy works. (I understand it conceptually, just not in practice.)

MDK actually said it best honestly. A minimum wage is not the healthiest thing for a free market, but it's necessary from the social perspective, in the same manner anti-discrimination laws are necessary for employment: Because there are still some companies that [i]would[/i] say no to a perfectly functional person just because they're chocolate flavoured, not vanilla.

[quote=Jorick]
Oh, so you want to talk about a different subject entirely and not sidetrack a thread with discussion about that other topic, alri--Oh, so you actually didn't want to talk about an entirely different subject and are totally fine with sidetracking this thread with discussion about the other topic.Okay then, no point in actually attempting to engage in a reasonable discussion here, have fun with your continued efforts in trying to equate entirely unrelated things to try to support your opinions.
[/quote]

He's trying to disprove an argument I made a while ago by using extremes and irrational comparisons. I'm surprised he went to the effort of creating an entirely different thread for it though.

[quote=So Boerd]
So what if someone can not compete with another worker at the same price? What if I grew up in the inner city and got a crappy education, and now I need work experience if I am to go anywhere? Offered a high school student and a college graduate both at the same price who is the company going to hire?Today black teenage unemployment is 35% and white teenage unemployment is 20%. In 1948 Black teenage unemployment, even when blacks were openly discrimated against, was at 9.8% Congratulations, you have made a very racist law that favors white people. You are keeping young black people down, and for what? So that white people can live comfortably? Boy, doesn't that have a familiar ring.
[/quote]

I guess you forgot to mention the part where teenagers are not socially expected to work anymore. I mean, they can, and it's usually looked on well as a mark of responsibility or maturity, but they generally... Don't have to. Not from a social perspective.

I mean technically back when slavery was legal blacks had under 1% unemployment. So obviously slavery is better than a minimum wage, right? :rolleyes

As well, there was also a lot less people who lived in the United States. So employing them all was not nearly as difficult. On top of that there was a booming economy, not the piece of shit we have right now, corporations were generally limited in size and scope with a few exceptions (ex: oil companies) which helped to breed the very competition that the free market uses as its crystal meth, and so on.

There's also a lot of social plagues today to keep in mind that still affect african american populations, like ghetto culture. For an example of that, look at the Crips and Bloods.

There's a hell of a lot more at work here than you would like to admit.

Also, back in 1948, blacks were paid significantly less than whites were for participating in the same tasks, [i]because of the open discrimination[/i]. Nowadays, there's still some of that going on, but it isn't nearly as awful as it was before. (The main reason for the large pay gap between the two is because whites still hold the vast majority of top level positions in companies, which pay obscenely more than any position beneath them, which skewers the wage gap averages in favour of whites... Then again, if you look at average income based on ethnicity, asian americans actually average out the highest of the four... :hehe)