Brovo

Atheism 2.0 - Atheism using Religions perks.

The Id, Ego, Superego model is outdated. Has been for years. Just so you know.

Also, atheistic towards human rights?... What?... Uhh... Okay. That's a new one.

Also... I already told you. Human beings made Human rights. They aren't perfect and they vary from society to society. There is no such thing as universal human rights, or human rights without exceptions, and so on... But hey, once again you are in love with your no true Scotsman. You also just can't seem to get past the whole idea that god is in no way comparable to beliefs on how human beings should be treated by other human beings from the perspective of a human being.

This is so irrational. It would be like if I implied that your Christianity made you a rapist. Because other Christians rape people. Just... Wow. Okay.

Also, really?... Atheistic to human rights? Like not killing each other, or respecting individual choices... What kind of insane god complex do you have to sincerely believe this?

Atheism 2.0 - Atheism using Religions perks.

Strange that you see pain, turmoil, sorrow, and such things, as being bad things. They are the things one uses to understand problems and give meaning to joy and life. I mean look at wealth as an example: The richest people in the world can afford literally anything they want. Any item, as many pretty trophy waifus and prostitutes as they desire. They could buy friendships, even, and never worry about running out of money for them. They could save anything they care for, or at least give it the best possible fighting chance with an army of doctors and lawyers and so on... And yet some of them still manage to be depressed. Unhappy. And so on.

Joy means nothing without pain. Victory means nothing without obstacles. We are mortal creatures that live to do that which we wish to, but without obstacles, struggle, pain, setbacks... Life has no meaning.

As well, your personal bias is showing when you state that their lives are worse. According to who, you? Me? The skydaddy? It is their life. Let them choose to do with it as they please so long as it does not infringe on someone else's life. If they wanna drink until their liver bursts, let them. If they wanna become professional boxers and risk brain damage later on in life, let them. If they want to play every video game ever and be fat fucks, let them. I can still laugh at that, or scratch my head in confusion, but then, I am not any I'd those people. The fat guy might actually like being fat. The boxer might actually enjoy the thrill of being injured.

You and I are not gods. We do not get to arbitrarily decide what is the "best life", consensus gets to judge that, and it is up to you, me, and whoever else, to try and argue our case if we feel it is important enough.

And -that- is democracy in action. Human rights come into play to prevent tyranny of the majority.

Is there ever a reason to not prove something if it can be proven?

mdk said
I made a change in bold. If we all afforded one another that same courtesy, the world would be a better place; sadly, religious or atheist or pastafarian, we collectively cannot seem to resist the urge.

I can drink to that sentiment. Cheers.

Atheism 2.0 - Atheism using Religions perks.

First of all... What does this have to do with human rights, really?

Second of all... I have no reason to force everyone to use this device, and it would be violating their right to choose for themselves, so... No.

Also, personally, I would not use this device. I like the real world just fine, thanks, but if others wanted to use it... Meh.

Atheism 2.0 - Atheism using Religions perks.

So Boerd said
Clearly the point is lost on you. Why should I afford you human rights?Because "better" is subjective, give me any objective criteria by which to measure it (including the percentage of people who self-identify as happy) and I can craft you a society which maximizes any number of those criteria by not respecting human rights, a society in which you would not want to live regardless of its superior consequences.

Again you're speaking in terms of perfection when I'm not. What defines human rights varies from culture to culture, nation to nation, person to person. And you should afford me human rights by measure of the fact that it is necessary for civilization? O.o I do not understand how this is a question. If I work with you and give you human rights equal to mine, and you extend the gesture, we are strengthened through a mutual desire to exist with as many undisturbed freedoms and independence as is possible.

Or we can not do that and go back to old testament racial genocides because the voices in our head told us to do that. You know, barbarism and all that. If you prefer that, go right ahead, my society however will object to that.

Atheism 2.0 - Atheism using Religions perks.

So Boerd said
That's like using the Bible to prove God. By the way, on the topic of founding documents,"...that [all men] are endowed by their with certain inalienable rights"

Except no. You asked for evidence of human rights, I gave you one. If you tried to murder me, you would be punished for violating my human right to live.

Humans made human rights. If you're talking about some sort of higher, indomitable "collective" of human rights that some sky daddy made, no, of course there aren't any. If you murder me, the universe isn't going to suddenly strike you down with the hammer of the flying spaghetti monster, you could legitimately get away with it.

As for "human rights" in the sense of morality: Empathy, sympathy, and our being social animals, in combination with an ever evolving society that grows more and more complex, requires a more advanced set of laws and guidelines by which to live our lives, which includes human rights.

This is pretty simple shit mate.

As for that document, that [all men] are endowed by their creator, you'll note they didn't say God. Or a Goddess. Or even a deity. You can construe creator to mean all sorts of things and that was the intent of it. If you believe your creator was your parents, it still works. If you believe your creator was the Judeo-Christian God, then it still works. That is the purpose of that document. Plus I'm not saying the document is perfect, I'm not saying that the things on it are without flaw, and I'm not saying it's a universal truth. I'm also not using it to prove that there is an invisible sky daddy watching over us all that you can't ever see, hear, or touch: I'm using it to prove that there are human rights which we created. Because if you murder me in front of the police, they'll arrest your ass. For violating my human rights.

Is there ever a reason to not prove something if it can be proven?

Why in the world would I want to prove something to someone else?

-Scientifically: To better understand the world through the gathering of evidence and information, hard facts, logic.

-Personally: Whatever works best for me may not work best for others. Besides, if I firmly believe something myself, while I can try to explain it to others, there's no point in trying to "convert" them.

Others can have their opinion about that, and I can think it wrong just as they can think themselves right, and so long as we can coexist, and tolerate one another, and at least have some rudimentary ability to understand each other, then we're all good. I don't have to "prove" to a Christian my atheism for instance: I cannot prove to a person how it is I internally think beyond a shadow of a doubt. They're not telepaths, and what would it even matter to them? So long as they don't try to misconstrue my atheism for being something it's not, and use that to predispose judgement or otherwise, why should I care? Let them believe what they believe, and let me not believe that thing they believe, and so long as they're good neighbours and I'm a good neighbour and we all just leave each other alone in our personal spaces, what does it matter to prove it?

Atheism 2.0 - Atheism using Religions perks.

So Boerd said
Has anyone been able to prove the existence of human rights yet?

The Last Bastion: Bunker Chicago

@Everyone: Post going up Tuesday morning. Gonna catch up on the IC stuff at work during breaks.

Getting back into the flow of things~ Ladedadeda~

The Silver Leaves; A Northern Crusade.

Dear Denizens of RPG,

This RP is worth your time. Look at it. Trust me.

Sincerely, the guy who's got two RP's running successfully.