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  • Old Guild Username: Jiskastya
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    1. Jiskastya 12 yrs ago

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That sounds like it could work. We were born from the relationships between two or more things, and then we take those two or more things and weave them together in various patterns to create other things? Is that what you mean?
Hmm... interesting concept...

I'd rather not bring in "other beings like ourselves," because that means that the gods came from somewhere, and then somewhere there are more of them. It brings them away from god-hood. And I'm certain that there are ways that other gods could appear, but to me it has always felt like, to be a god and not a... being, the gods need to be intrinsically linked to the universe itself. And that means it is at the beginning, and it will be until the end. That is my own bit of unconventional-ism, if you like.

The other possibility is that the main gods, the ones who would be accepted, and also not the ones we would be playing, are not... people-ish-things. They aren't like the Greek or Hindu gods, or even like the Christian god. They are... conscious essences, constant in whatever manner in which they exist, be it chaotic or unchanging, and a part of everything. The ones that we would be playing could either be... like children of these essences, or somehow born due to any conflict that may occur between the essences?

Hmm... I actually have an idea somewhat like that which I haven't thought about in a while... It only has one of the "other" type of god, but I'm sure that could be worked around... Probably better to build from scratch, though. Preconceived notions, and all.
Ahkay... My only concern with having the gods interact directly with the mortals as gods is that mortals tend to get demanding if they are allowed to. So, if they know that the gods are real, and the gods want the mortals to worship them, what is to stop the mortals from going "do this or we will stop worshiping you"?
I'd rather build something up together, just so that we balance things out together.

Are you going to want to roleplay as the gods? Or would you rather create gods, and then roleplay as the people in the world they create? Or a combination thereof?

It'd be fascinating to have a god or gods that get mixed into the general affairs of mortals. Just a god that puts on a human skin and wanders around and joins in on adventures. For some purpose, of course, but still an interesting concept.
I'm taking that as acceptance of switching over?
Oh, Pope, we are both making this so very hard... Normally I'm good with taking a long time on planning, but I really do feel like we have made only half an ounce of progress on this. The constant back and forth and changes and disagreements has really killed my buzz... Not that I mind butting heads a little bit, it is great to go back and forth until we are both satisfied, but there are also times when it feels like we each know what we have in our head, and they are both valid options to ourselves, and maybe even moderately valid to each other, and we just wind up in an endless back and forth, and that is about what it feels like we are at now.

If there is some way we can work around that easier I'd love to, but if there isn't... maybe we can come up with a plot that will allow us to do the planning as we go? Something... where a world is just beginning, and at the beginning there is nothing to know, so that there are no expectations to be met, and then we come up with our stories, and slowly build a world together?
That might be a reasonable why... The organization is dedicated to keeping the secrets of the Walkers. That is their whole purpose. I have two concerns with that, though. First, how could one of those children be born without the secret being revealed in the first place? I can't imagine that the Walker children are born disguised. Which would mean, that as soon as the child was born the secret would be "out." Also, sure, rape, but still. Why would one of the Walkers want to have sex with a human? Don't the Walkers kind of consider humanity... the bane of existence? Also, as a slightly more major problem, why would that mean that the Organization members have to get killed? They know their job. They'd do it if they need to. Or, at least, not all of them wouldn't do it...

What I could see, though, is having a group of Walkers who are looking to purposefully expose the presence of the Walkers to the humans. Probably in some sort of massive conquest thing. A kind of Cult, dedicated to having the walkers rise above and take control of the "inferior" humans, who only rule through population. And perhaps they have some messed up sort of magic that can do some minor mind control. Which is why everyone, Organization members included, was killed. Because they succumbed, and turned traitor. So one of the powerful higher ups ahd to come and personally clean up the mess. But, of course, that didn't end the Cult. It could be one of the recurring problems, if we like. And, for one reason or another, our characters are directly connected to it. Either because they can resist the mind control, or they are literally connected to it, or someone simply decides that they are the two for the job.

Why would the Organization not pay well? And, perhaps even more importantly, why would people who are very rich, and are therefore used to living in luxury, hire on for a job that doesn't pay well, that requires them to obey all orders, and, if they don't pay well, probably doesn't have a high standard of living? It is completely counter-intuitive. Frankly, the rich go to where they can make more money. And maybe the Walkers are different, but it still seems backwards to me that they would go and work. especially if they are rich enough and influential enough that they could probably get a job anywhere they wanted. Also, the fact that they live a long time would mean that there would be less workers, not more. A longer life span means less children per year, which means less children who would be of the right age to work in the Organization.

I don't think the number of employees would really go down with time. Yes, there may be less problems, the Organization would have control. But the more control there is the more dissent there will be brewing just under the surface. As soon as it starts looking like the Organization is weakening in power, people are going to try and rise up. If the presence of one of the Enforcers is enough to calm things down, that still means you need an enforcer at every dispute, and I can't imagine that the frequency of disputes is going to have gotten any less. Think about America. We have the strongest military in the world, but we have to constantly work to keep growing it, so that it still looks like we could whup your ass in a second if you step out of line. I don't think the Organization is looking for a point where they can just kind of... fade out. They are the power, and whether they are a good power or a bad power is beside the point. They are going to want to stay in power.

What I meant by “Money, protection, a chance to have a position of authority,” ... Think about America again. The reason so many people work in the Government, whether they like the government or not, whether they like their job or not, is because it pays well, because it is a very stable job, one that they are not likely to lose, and it has very good benefits. Seeing as the Organization is pretty much like the government of the Walkers, why would it be any different? Besides, many of the downsides to a government job, like the fact that it is incredibly inefficient and many people are lazy, would be removed because of the strict control within the Organization itself. Even if the Walkers don't like the Organization, if they see it as a cruel overlord, there are still going to be people who will go and work for them. Maybe their family is sick, and they need the Organization to pay for whatever substitutes as Medical Bills. Which the Organization would probably only do for employees. Maybe they want to be close to the "boss," so that, if or when things go bad, they will be on the "winning" side. All I'm trying to say is that, just because the Organization is disliked, doesn't mean that people won't still go and work for them.

I think I got everything... let me know if I missed anything you'd like me to expand upon.
Getting it turned into a multi-squad thing works fine for me. That will also add a little mystery, because it probably starts out relatively routine, so why it devolved.

Umm... I'd be cool with having the Organization connected to the butchering if and only if there is a very sound reason for it. Not necessarily good, but sound. Something more than corruption. It is something... I'd be open to, although I'd rather not make it key. If you know what I mean. Either way, if we are going to follow that, I'd like to know what and why before we start. Because it will directly connect to whatever the strangeness is.

The same with the adoption thing. I find the feasibility of that rather limited, because I can't help but imagine that the people who work for the Organization don't exactly get "weekends off." I also imagine that they would highly frown upon having a child in the base of the Organization. In all honesty, I really only threw out that idea because I know you liked the idea of the half day and night children. It isn't one of my favorite ideas. Lets put that one on hold, and once we get a little further into the story we can re-open it for discussion. By that point I will know both the world and the characters a little better, and my decision will be easier.

I could see the traditional families sending children to be in the Organization, but I wouldn't say that they are the majority of the workers. After all, there aren't that many rich people in the world, there simply can't be, and the Organization kind of needs to be everywhere at once. Which means they either need really powerful workers or a large number of workers. My guess is that they would go for both. And only a small portion of the available families can't fill that. I'm certainly happy to have that be a part of things, and I could see one supposedly "elite" force entirely comprised of those kinds of people, but I also think there are enough people who would join the Organization for other reasons. Money, protection, a chance to have a position of authority, or simply the foresight to see that the Organization my really be a necessary and good thing.
I like the idea that our duo gets assigned a mission, although I think it should be large enough that there would be more than one team going. That way, we can play around with their relationship in front of other people, as well as away from them.

... How about this. For some reason or another, our guys leave halfway through this mission, and when they return to the Organization they learn that the teams who remained were all butchered, and suspicion has fallen on... one of them. Not both. They have to figure out who did it while under constant scrutiny. This antagonistic force is looking to break down/ take over the organization, and turn it into the evil organization that we were considering before. The best way to do that is break it from the inside, and, for some reason... our characters are an ideal place to start.

That could get a nice mix of conspiracy, action, and conflict, mixed in with the daily life of the Organization members, and the brunt they have to take from a public that hates them. Because I do believe that the Organization has to get its hands dirty fairly often. And some, maybe even most, people don't support it. But it isn't necessarily cruel or bloodthirsty.

Of course, all the while, the humans are, for one reason or another, drawing closer to figuring out about the existence of the Walkers. Perhaps a halfbreed child between a human and one of the races? Or another malignant force that wants the humans to wipe out the Walkers?

Any of that sound good to you?
Hey, Pope. As ever, very sorry for the delay. I had to do a bit of thinking.

Your idea about the Organization is entirely possible in this world. In fact, I would even go so far as to say it is plausible. It could happen. There is no doubt of that. But I've realized something else. I don't really... want it to happen. There is no reason that the Organization couldn't be corrupt and a monster that should be destroyed, but that doesn't mean it has to be, right? I love the world, I'm fascinated by the relationship between the Day and Nightwalkers. I like the relationship between our characters, that they pretend to only be paired by force, but are secretly really good friends. I'd be very interested in having a half-breed child who somehow integrates his way into the story. But an evil organization controlled by a corrupt leader, and a rebellion determined to bring them down? It just feels... like something I won't be able to get behind. I'm sorry, because I know you like the idea a lot. But can we change it? Pick something else that drives the plot?
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