Kho

Lords, Ladies and Lies of the Court

I'm happy waiting until Saturday since am doing lots of work this week and can't really post much, so take your time and make this intro post good ;)

World in Revolution: 1861

^ That's tough love, and a metaphorical slap to help everyone see things in perspective :P
We should all relax.

World in Revolution: 1861

bigscreech said
Or you guys could settle this dispute the old fashion way:p

Hmm...blame Mexico for all our immigrant problems?

World in Revolution: 1861

So Boerd said
That they won't roll over.

We don't need to discuss what will and won't happen, beyond our own evidences and reasoning there is just bashing each other with 'am right' 'no you're wrong, am right.'
Outcast has a job to do after all, he can decide, and if these debates help, great ;)

World in Revolution: 1861

So Boerd said
What economic weakness? is in huge demand!

That is a temporary circumstance as Dedonus has pointed out. The rest of the economy is in complete disarray. Not until the reign of Ismail does Egypt really pick up. Right now though, the economy isn't great, literacy is very poor - apart from the rising middle class - and the nation is generally not in a good way. Anyway, what's this whole debate leading to? Is there a point you're trying to make?

World in Revolution: 1861

@Boerd Of course they could never waltz in when Muhammed Ali was at the height of his power, but at this moment in history, with the weakness of the Egyptian economy before Ismail's rule, and with my reforms of the Ottoman Empire, I am in a much better position to 'waltz' in. I don't even need to waltz in, I can tell them to come dance with me.

@ Pasta haha, madness, I get it, terrible :P
But in all seriousness, I know you're not playing to win, but you could've won.

World in Revolution: 1861

So Boerd said
Isn't that exactly when countries have protests? When they have issues?Your source says the religious types were weakened. At the apex of their strength, why didn't they revolt on support of the Caliph in the first Turko-Egyptian war?

And they did - note resistance to French and British rule, respectively.
As for the Ottoman-Egyptian War (starting 1831, unless you mean the Mameluke wars) Muhammed Ali was seen as liberator (from the French) and one who was not defecting from the Empire as such, merely wishing to have greater power WITHIN the Empire, as shown by the fact that Egypt remained a vassal, and he remained the Governor of Egypt. Further, Muhammed Ali did much to modernise Egypt - though shirt-lived due to British intervention - and there was no need to revolt against a good despotic ruler to replace him with a poor one.

Lords, Ladies and Lies of the Court

Roran...your character...we're going to have so much fun :P (not saying am not going to have fun with you as well Parti, or Ana, or Fab, or Aeroplane, just saying we're going to have a lot of fun, you know, like I will with everyone else...not saying that I will specifically have more fun with Henri than I would with the next Dick, Joe or Tom, I'm just...you know...stating the obvious...yeah...that...I'll stop now.)

World in Revolution: 1861

In case you missed this:

Kho said
I don't think I need to prove the Albanian background of Muhammed Ali Pasha and therefore his dynasty and the fact that the ruling elite were largely of Anatolian or East European origins. There was a rise in the 'effendy's' as they were known, secular educated Egyptians, lawyers, teachers etc. plus you must remember that the oldest/second oldest (depends on who you ask) university in the world is in Egypt.The rural population was extremely unhappy under the Khedives and so were the ulema (religious class if you would, imams, sheikhs etc.) - who had monumental power over the masses and could, on their own, lead a successful uprising to 'rejoin the true Caliphate'For more info: http://countrystudies.us/egypt/23.htmFor more info on general change in Muslim societies, particularly Arab ones, in the 19th-20th Century: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Nahda

And no, there were no great protests because the country was too busy with its own issues.

World in Revolution: 1861

emmy1320 said
Dobby is a free elf.

Yes, and I'm Harry Potter. Russia is Lucius Malfoy. Austria is Bellatrix.