The 42nd Gecko

The War of the Three

@KoL Computer Science. My physics teacher wanted to poach me into Physics, but that was the first semester, where I did really well and generally ended up teaching my group how to do it. I was considering putting a minor in it. By the third semester, things did not go as well, and I squeaked by, and called it there.

Also, aw... Didn't you want to add "maths" to the list of things Windel can't let be brought up around you?

The War of the Three

@TheWindel Psssh, just ignore it. It won't mean anything in the end. Everyone's power levels will fluctuate wildly to accommodate better fight scenes and story.

Also, thanks to the math off, I realize I had Miyu survive a deceleration of about 50,000 g's. I should probably retcon all of her things and give Henry his sword back.

The War of the Three

@KoL I was using Fermi estimation to get ideas of the scales of the different forces in comparison to each other. I made a lot of errors because Fermi estimation is basically "don't sweat the details." So, let's begin the true math off, and begin our physics contest in earnest.

1. You're right, I goofed in the first part, mistook momentum and force there for a bit, and made another error noted below. The number I actually wanted was actually a little higher than your result, which would be 30,000 kg * 9.9 m/s (which is what the velocity would be after 7 meter jump, I accidentally used average velocity instead of velocity). Made a difference of a factor of about x2, which is within Fermi estimation error range. However, it fortunately matches up with gravity's acceleration pretty well, so we can use your result just fine without meaningful difference.

2. I'll defer to your expertise, I didn't get to Pascals much in my college physics. Mind doing the calculations for 132 teranewtons of force and a 160 mm^2 area? However, if I understand correctly, this is a case where the effective force scales inversely with the square of the area. A 160 mm^2 area will have 160^2 less force per square meter than a 1 mm^2 area. So, 25,600 times less force. I had assumed my sword was a x10 multiplier, but I'll change it to a x25,600 multiplier! If I'm wrong, it's probably a x160 modifier, yeah?

3. You made my earlier momentum = force error here! I also made this error and some general other stupidity! Instead, if we want to do this right, we have to bring Impulse into the equation. Specifically this equation. Impulse = Force * Time = Change in Momentum. Your time, by your definition is .00001 seconds. Since we want to go from our current speed to zero, the change in momentum is the momentum! Sooo, doot do doot. Momentum = 44 m/s * 30,000 kg = Force (unknown) * .00001 seconds. Which gives us Force = 132,000,000,000 kg*m/s^2. Which is 1000 times my calculation and 100,000 times yours! We're dealing in "tera" prefix things again, and the power of Juno again is in the Miyu would need a four order of magnitude power up to be in the same playing field. We take my earlier result of 66 Miyu units, halve for my average/end velocity goof before, 33, and then multiply it by 1000 to get 33,000 Miyu units. Oh, then multiply by 10 for Juno/Jorm again to get 330,000 Miyu units (because before I only did that for the nuke calc). Can I hear 5 orders of magnitude? Also, remember this is a situation where Juno hardly considered this an attack and was surprised Miyu suffered damage. But wait! My multiplier on the Miyu unit from sword effectiveness is changing to 25,600! I already applied a x10, so we'll divide 330,000 by 2,560 and get: 12.8! Miyu's attack is 12.8 times less for the same amount of area. While Jorm's attack did do severe damage, it did so by blunt force and acceleration. It didn't tear through Henry like a sword blade. Thus, Miyu's blade wouldn't penetrate his skin, even if it did have another 12.8 times relative force (for example, if you say Jorm form actually only increases say, 10% instead of something more significant). And because the blunt force is lower by a factor of 3,300,000 (taking away the original x10 modifier to the Miyu unit), Henry is going to be mildly nonplussed at how the blade bounces off him. And again, this is all entirely assuming an attack that Juno didn't consider an attack and was surprised Miyu took damage from, was Juno's best effort.

4. You directly equated newtons to joules. This is a no no. You also moved the decimal place wrong. Also "her goal being to bisect the machine piloted by the traitor angel with a single swing that carried behind it the energy of one of the nukes Miyu had just dropped over her own allies." So, yeaaaah. You did not write "a perfectly reasonable energy given Juno's mass and speed." I was assuming Juno has magical powers augmenting her attacks. Granted, given how her speed appears to be teleportation to us, I wouldn't be surprised if her actual speed was 28,284 m/s.

The War of the Three

@TheWindel Since Juno showed up and people tried to keep up.

The War of the Three

@TheWindel@KoL *Name Kerflufle.
Yes, KoL has it exactly, I meant KoL.

@floodtalon Alright, are you ready for some Fermi estimation? Cause buckle up.

Let's say Miyu's mech weighs 1/2 as much as an M1 Abrams. They're both heavily armored fighty vehicles. The Daimyo is 16 ft tall to the 8 ft tall M1 Abrams, but an M1 Abrams is 26 feet long to the Daimyo's probably 4-5. That puts the Daimyo at 30,000 kilograms.

Let's say the Daimyo jumps off a two story building, and lands sword point down on Henry. This is an unlikely scenario, but it's about how high the Daimyo could pull off a superhero landing from without damage, making it a good measure of the total power the musculature can withstand and put out under optimal scenarios, if everything lined up absolutely perfectly. A quick bit of math reveals that Miyu would deal about 180,000 Newtons a second from this impact, (30,000 kg * 6 m/s). And let's say her super sword provides about a 10x multiplier to that effective force.

So, 1,800,000 Newtons of effective force.

Let's round up, and call 2,000,000 Newtons one "Miyu Unit". Also you should note that I have rounded up on everything glossed over in the "quick bit of math." We are being generous. Now, from now on, I'll start rounding down to find a minimum of Juno's power.

Let's consider how hard Juno hits. Well, we do know that she decelerated without any difficulty the Daimyo Super version from full speed to zero so fast it seemed instant. We'll call .1 of a second an instant, as we've got people with hyper reaction speeds. Some quick math and an assumption about it's full speed (let's say 100 mph, which is rather slow on this battlefield full of speedsters so fast they leave after images), that's about 132,000,000 (30,000 kg * 44 m/s * 100 to go from momentum to force) Newtons a second. Or, 66 Miyu units.

Uh oh. A situation in which Juno wasn't even trying, and she didn't even consider her attack a direct attack, and was surprised the mech came apart, is 66 times Miyu's maximum damage output.

But this was not Juno's power when she's being serious. When she attacked Miyu directly, her strike was said to have the power of a small nuke? How much power is that? The smallest nuke we know of is W54, a tactical type. The only type that was generally consistently successful? Six kilotons. How much is six kilotons? 24 Terajoules. Terajoules. Say that to yourself. Terajoules. 24,000,000,000. Now, joules and newtons are not the same. So, let's transform Miyu's earlier newton's into joules by finding what her kinetic energy was (.5 * 30,000 kg * 6^2 m/s). We get 5,400,000 joules after we apply the x10 from the sword. We'll round up to 6,000,000, with our general being generous for Miyu and stingy for Juno. 24,000,000,000 is 4000 Miyu units.

But wait! You survived an attack from Juno after she transformed into Jorm! Let's put another x10 on that, because her speed went from "fast enough you can still dodge if you're at least partly speed type" to "fast enough it looks like teleportation".

That puts the strength of one of Jorm's attacks at 40,000 Miyu units.

Unless Miyu increased her strength by at least four orders of magnitude, she's not going to even start hurting you.

.:: ℤ𝕖𝕝𝕕𝕒 - 𝕎𝕙𝕚𝕤𝕡𝕖𝕣𝕤 𝕚𝕟 𝕥𝕙𝕖 ℕ𝕚𝕘𝕙𝕥 ::.

@Dervish Because you're a ghost, and ghosts can't have nice things.

The War of the Three

@floodtalon Windel did that, and I'm still not quite sure why. It's not like this weird suddenly appearing passage that one of the attacking forces should have used ended up going anyplace special or causing me to meet someone strange.

Also, darn it, you went through with it... Am I ever going to get to fight someone I can hit, dodge, hurt, or can't one shot me?

Henry just tanked being kicked part-way through a mountain and several walls without using silver armor eyes, so I am calling shenanigans on "glass cannon" defense. Miyu couldn't have ever hurt him with any of her own weapons unless Juno had thrown her at Henry. :P

The War of the Three

@floodtalon For a description of your surroundings, go ahead and read the posts that haven't been directed at you, that were occurring inside Alt Signia.

Hell, if you wanted to ruin Miyu's and Shizuka's day, you could slam through the wall into the teleporter room.

The War of the Three

Aw, it looks like it's back to our normal pace for now. We were going really fast there for awhile.

The War of the Three

Miyu

Was the deads. Oops.

@Ryonara