Frokane's Mildly Politcal Hangout Thread

[The Harbinger of Ferocity]

@Dynamo Frokane

You again return to James Allsup, who I have previously stated I know little to nothing about and only ever came to read into the name when you brought them up. If I recall correctly, there is question if that person is, but there is suggestion they might well be an actual racist. I would need retread that ground because, in all honesty, it was a meaningless point; everything is called racist now, to be frank. Too many times has wolf been cried. To not end there on the matter, no it does not bother me you have proof suggesting he might well be. Why would it? Should it bother me you have something to support that? Continued, why would I care about who James Allsup is? Especially to the point I should seemingly be irked by this apparent disparity?

As to my specificity, what I am saying is that it is somehow reasonable to consider Lauren Southern "Alt-Right" just as it is to call many others "Alt-Right", but only because she's a woman and white. My point is, she is probably popular because she's "Alt-Right" and having a level of attractiveness is not going to harm her standing there.

As for Generation Identity? Let me see what they have to say for themselves.

Generation Identity's Demands - Information in Full

An open debate about identity
We finally want an open debate on the identity issue in the 21st century. The established opinion spectrum narrows this question only to the utopia of a unified one-world ideology.

Remigration
Illegal immigration must not become normalized. We need the return of all illegal immigrants in a humane manner and a movement in demographic trends towards remigration. The large population exchange that has been and is underway in Europe requires a clear reversal of the migratory flows. That reversal will serve the preservation of peace, security and freedom in all European countries.

Preservation of ethnocultural identity
Appreciation for one’s own ethnocultural identity
We demand a world of diversity, peoples and cultures. The preservation of our ethnocultural identity must be anchored as basic consensus and as a fundamental right in society.
We, on the other hand, demand a world of diversity, peoples and cultures. The preservation of our ethnocultural identity must be anchored as basic consensus and as a fundamental right in society.

Defence of What’s Ours
We need a healthy relationship to patriotism and love of one’s home place as well as true freedom of expression. For many years, the political left has dominated the media and culture. Now it is time for an identitarian counter-voice to enter the stage. Love of one’s home place is not a crime, but something completely normal. We want everyone to be free to openly and honestly acknowledge their own culture and tradition without having to experience exclusion or discrimination.

Help in Place
Mass immigration destroys Europe and emigration destroys Africa. Let us, therefore, support the regional development of those countries that are characterized by war and poverty, thus creating options for people to remain and to find opportunities in their own homelands.

Secure Borders
Our borders must finally be protected again and the nation-state must regain its sovereignty over border policies. We need immediate government action to regain the security and control of our own territory. Current immigration flows require the immediate implementation of measures to ensure peace and stability in our country.

Preservation of ethnocultural identity
Appreciation for one’s own ethnocultural identity
We demand a world of diversity, peoples and cultures. The preservation of our ethnocultural identity must be anchored as basic consensus and as a fundamental right in society.
We, on the other hand, demand a world of diversity, peoples and cultures. The preservation of our ethnocultural identity must be anchored as basic consensus and as a fundamental right in society.

Generation Identity

I imagine this is the issue taken?

[mdk]

<Snipped quote by mdk>
As far as I know, "YouTube's HQ is in California, so California laws apply across the platform" isn't a valid excuse, because the California law regarding secretly recording people doesn't explicitly mention transmitting the recording.

@catchamber

Neat, and sensical. Still, if I were unwittingly made to be the transmitter, I too might balk (though to be fair, if I were the transmitter I'd also be a lot more concerned about the appearance of censoring political views than YouTube apparently is, and that might affect where I draw a line).

[Dolerman]

As to my specificity, what I am saying is that it is somehow reasonable to consider Lauren Southern "Alt-Right" just as it is to call many others "Alt-Right", but only because she's a woman and white.

@The Harbinger of Ferocity

Can you find the post where I asserted this? Because this is looking a little bit like a real strawman and not the made up Sleeping Silence version.

So you have no issue with white nationalism now? Okay well I'm a little surprised that someone 'right of center' is defending it. But considering some of the positions I've seen you take in this thread I guess this day was always going to come. I have nowhere near enough energy to explain to you the moral and ethical problems with white indentitarianism. Good day to you sir.

[POOHEAD189]

Lauren Cherie Southern is a Canadian far-right political activist, Internet personality, and journalist associated with the alt-right.

This is the first sentence on her wikipedia page.

[IceHeart]

<Snipped quote by IceHeart>

And I'd prefer if you didn't misrepresent my country with assertions based on clickbait-rag titles. But the world is a cruel place right?

I guessed you were a libertarian and I was right, you also didn't refute being called a race realist, so I'm assuming I'm right about that too.

@Dynamo Frokane

Right, because the UK is all sunshine and rainbows where no one is shut down just because they have an unpopular opinion. So yes the world is a cruel place and I will criticize your country as much as I want, thank you very much, the same way you criticize my country and various people and groups.

You have a very strange habit of trying to put the labels you want to give on everyone else. I say I probably share a lot of ideas in common with libertarians, you say that makes me a libertarian. You claim I'm a race realist just because I didn't bother to try and refute you, well how can you claim I'm something if I say nothing about it? All you're doing is slapping whatever label you find convenient without bothering to get to know the person's positions.

Instead of slapping labels all over the place just discuss the issues at hand with thought and tact.

Anyway I can see this is going nowhere so for now, I think I'll go back to just watching this thread. It's always interesting to see how people react to each other but my time is better spent elsewhere. Anyway, this thread always manages to provide me with plenty of amusement even when I don't contribute to it. XD

Later!

[Polymorpheus]

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[The Harbinger of Ferocity]

@Dynamo Frokane

And what personality? Please market Lauren's personality to me in a way that would make want to listen to her if I didn't know what she looked like. You know for a fact her followers would be a fraction of what they are if she wasn't an attractive girl. Tell me why brittany pettibone is popular, I'm curious to see why you think she is? Her personality?

In essence the argument suggests she's famous only because she's white and a woman, not because she holds relatively popular, easily exploited political beliefs at the moment - this I noted prior and repeated several times. There's no real attack, approach, or criticism of her politics in it, let alone acknowledging just how she seems to have gained her base. As a whole, the context of what I am speaking to refers back to this; there's no actual, legitimate critique of her other than that which I have engaged to as of late. More importantly, I am not expressly claiming that is your opinion or sticking it on you because of the reality you are not claiming it as that, at least where I have bore witness to.

Carrying on, however.

So you have no issue with white nationalism now? Okay well I'm a little surprised that someone 'right of center' is defending it. But considering some of the positions I've seen you take in this thread I guess this day was always going to come. I have nowhere near enough energy to explain to you the moral and ethical problems with white indentitarianism. Good day to you sir.

I have no issue with people, nations, or societies wanting to keep their individual identities in their own homeland. That is radically different from sponsoring white nationalism and to be direct, I have and will always believe it is the duty of immigrants to adopt the ways, customs, and natures of their new homelands and attempt to fit themselves to it. I pulled the information directly from Generation Identity to have a discussion on the matter, not how the media portrays them or what the rumor mill says, but now you have stooped to the low of accusing me of "white nationalism" simply because I am "Right of Center" and question the validity of it being wrong or right to preserve cultures, then have so chosen to claim the moral high ground and attempt to bow out. Does that not strike you as odd in any fashion?

However, do note that is pretty petty and the sole reason I am not pursuing it is simply because you do not wish to discuss it, to say utterly nothing of how you just blatantly attempted to villainize me. Good day to you indeed.

[Mao Mao]

15k people liked the original post, meaning that they agree with the message. that's super yikes™

[Penny]

I can see why many people would feel that way. It isn't as though liberals have always been great but there are a lesser percentage of them who pray for gays to burn in hell.

[Polymorpheus]

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[Penny]

Yet they still equate conservatives with enmity towards their way of life. Very strange.

[Dolerman]

You have a very strange habit of trying to put the labels you want to give on everyone else.

@IceHeart

If the shoe fits....

I'm curious to know if you've actually seen those videos.

@catchamber

I have, and I don't see how 'well presented' equates sharp wit.

[Dolerman]

@The Harbinger of Ferocity Hang on are you saying that you don't think generation identity are white nationalists?

You don't think they use the terms ethnicity, culture, identity and race interchangeably? What do you think white nationalism is?

[POOHEAD189]

There's a lot of conservatives that don't care one way or the other. The majority of conservatives I have met in my life really could not care less about homosexuality, meaning oppressing them as well. It's just a popular image to portray conservatives as "all gays are sexual deviants meant for hell," if the conservative in question is even Christian. They might just like guns and dislike immigration.

Of course there is a larger population of conservatives that think that way compared to liberals, but by the 'wrong century' that catchamber meant, is that in the 19th or mid 20th century no one questioned that gays were inherently bad (at least I think thats what he meant).

Also my parents are liberal democrats and still think Trans people shouldn't be allowed in the bathrooms they identify with so.

[Polymorpheus]

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[Penny]

There's a lot of conservatives that don't care one way or the other.

@POOHEAD189

So at best they dont care about gay rights and are more than willing to go along with those that do?

It's just a popular image to portray conservatives as "all gays are sexual deviants meant for hell."

@POOHEAD189

Find somebody that feels that way and I feel fairly safe taking a stab at their political leanings.

[POOHEAD189]

So at best they dont care about gay rights and are more than willing to go along with those that do?

@Penny

No, I'm just saying they have conservative leanings, that doesn't mean they go along with anyone. They honestly just might not pay attention, or be ignorant about gay rights at all and think marriage was the end of the issue.

Find somebody that feels that way and I feel fairly safe taking a stab at their political leanings.

I agree!

[Penny]

No, I'm just saying they have conservative leanings, that doesn't mean they go along with anyone. They honestly just might not pay attention, or be ignorant about gay rights at all and think marriage was the end of the issue.

@POOHEAD189

You can, of course, be conservative without voting for the Republican Party but if you do vote for them, you ARE going along with the anti-gay agenda that many of its members appear to subscribe to.

[POOHEAD189]

You can, of course, be conservative without voting for the Republican Party but if you do vote for them, you ARE going along with the anti-gay agenda that many of its members appear to subscribe to.

@Penny

Yes, definitely no argument there. It's why I vote for democrats nowadays, even if I think some left wing stuff is annoying. That and environmental issues.

My point was it just seemed extreme for about 15k people to call that person a traitor when they didn't give any information on who the homosexual conservative voted for or what their ideas of any policies are. Just that they had conservative leanings.

[Penny]

My point was it just seemed extreme for about 15k people to call that person a traitor when they didn't give any information on who the homosexual conservative voted for or what their ideas of any policies are. Just that they had conservative leanings.

@POOHEAD189

I think its fairly clear the conservative is being read as Republican in this instance. Even if not, the very best you can can say about this person is that they are ideologically sympathetic to the coalition of people who have historically been committed to pushing anti-LBTQ policies. It isn't hard to see why people might react that way.