Batman makes a better villain than Superman, and we're finally gonna see that in this Dark Multiverse in DC Metal.

Superman to me is like a fine wine. He's an acquired taste. And 90% of writers don't know what they're doing with him.

The problem with Batman v Superman is that the movie was too caught up in it's own story of Lex setting up the confrontation between the two heroes, in that it took an extended cut of the movie to make more sense of it. However a three hour movie with that much exposition is horrible. Two minutes of Superman followed by twenty minutes of exposition. Two minutes of Batman followed by thirty minutes of exposition. Superman only had 43 lines of dialogue the entire film, and he was title star!

Directors can't find one story to try and adapt so they 'make their own' using bits from several stories. B v S took bits from Death of Superman, Dark Knight Returns, the Trinity monthly, etc. Now JL is taking bit from the New52 JL, World Without Superman, amd the Wally West era of the Flash [cause Barry had no personality in the Silver Age]. You know why the new Batman director Matt Reeves threw out the Afleck/Geoff Johns script for Batman? Because they did the same thing with their story and he knew it wouldn't translate to film.

-00492

And I agree how Cyborg makes no sense, DC/WB wanted him in the JL for all the wrong reasons, and making him part Motherbox and a teleporter doesn't make him a big gun. WB released an updated film schedule.... Cyborg is no longer getting a flick now. Probably has to do with the fact his comic can't even hold down 14k readers a month. I wouldn't waste millions on a character that obviously worked better in a different light and involved with younger heroes. I wonder if he'll actually say "booyah" in the JL movie.

Film schedule post SDCC:

Justice League
Aquaman
Shazam
Suicide Squad 2
The Batman
Justice League Dark
Batgirl
Green Lantern Corps
The Flash: Flashpoint
Wonder Woman 2

Gotham City Sirens, Black Adam, Cyborg, JL 2, and Nightwing must be part of their phase 2 plans now.

EDIT: I mainly said Batman/Superman needed to happen before the JL because they couldn't set it up in a solo character's movie. Had the story not involved Superman dying and Batman crossing the line and branding people I think it would've fared much better with a more classic hero team-up movie. Superman could've died at the beginning of JL by Doomsday and they could've shown more heroes in the DC movieverse when World Without Superman began in that flick.

Suicide Squad was their third movie because WB execs have wanted a villain style dirty dozen out of a cast of DC supervillains for well over a decade. To the point they set up the Suicide Squad to spin out of the failed GL movie [hence the appearance by Waller]. Had we got the darker version of that film with 30 minutes more Joker and less special effects at the end, I think we as comic fans would've enjoyed it much more.

-00492

I think the real problem with comics is that they aren't lighthearted all that much anymore. They're so... serious. Its probably why Deadpool is so ungodly popular come to think of it.

Well we'll see on the JL movie. Like I said, it depends on how much meddling there is. WW had almost no meddling and it turned out well. (It also didn't look horrendous. BvS... I wouldn't hire that director ever.) so if there is no meddling it should be good.

Now they really need to bring the cyborg everyone loves back. Sure keep his new look and powers, but he needs that booyah thing back. Thats what people remember him for.

<Snipped quote by Roman>

I'm kind of hoping he does exactly that because I don't like Synder's tone or vision. Everything is so dark and washed out, everyone is so dark. These are comic book movies, Wonder Woman was bright and vibrant (where appropriate, war and London not so much but to be fair they shouldn't be).

Batman Versus Superman was a mess. At the very least it should have been broken into two movies to give us time to develop motivations and characters instead of rushing through a wild goose chase of a plot. The first movie should have ended with the Batman and Superman fight, while the second movie would have focused on the fallout of said conflict with Lex going on to create Doomsday leading to the death of Superman.

We had a brief discussion regarding the movie in Discord yesterday and while I think it was Member who said that it had to happen before Justice League, I disagree. Batman and Superman should of had time to work together, friction building in their differences before eventually they come head to head after a mission goes horribly wrong. Batman could have quit the League and gone on to do his own thing before his actions bring him into conflict with Superman once again, ala The Dark Knight Returns where this entire idea is ripped from.

Batman Versus Superman should never have been the second entry to the DC Live Action Universe, and Suicide Squad should definitely not been the third. Warner Bros. should have set up their trinity in solo movies, hell even skipped Batman because you can, everyone knows his story. But yeah, I definitely think it should have been Man of Steel, Caped Crusader (Since Dark Knight was already done), Goddess of Truth and then led into Justice League where we introduce characters like Aquaman, Flash and (ugh) Cyborg. This then leads to spin offs and greater universe building.

/Endrant

I really want to like DC Movies, but they're making it so freakin' hard to do so.

Joss is insane now

<Snipped quote by Member 00492>

And I agree how Cyborg makes no sense, DC/WB wanted him in the JL for all the wrong reasons, and making him part Motherbox and a teleporter doesn't make him a big gun. WB released an updated film schedule.... Cyborg is no longer getting a flick now. Probably has to do with the fact his comic can't even hold down 14k readers a month. I wouldn't waste millions on a character that obviously worked better in a different light and involved with younger heroes. I wonder if he'll actually say "booyah" in the JL movie.

Film schedule post SDCC:

Justice League
Aquaman
Shazam
Suicide Squad 2
The Batman
Justice League Dark
Batgirl
Green Lantern Corps
The Flash: Flashpoint
Wonder Woman 2

Gotham City Sirens, Black Adam, Cyborg, JL 2, and Nightwing must be part of their phase 2 plans now.

EDIT: I mainly said Batman/Superman needed to happen before the JL because they couldn't set it up in a solo character's movie. Had the story not involved Superman dying and Batman crossing the line and branding people I think it would've fared much better with a more classic hero team-up movie. Superman could've died at the beginning of JL by Doomsday and they could've shown more heroes in the DC movieverse when World Without Superman began in that flick.

Suicide Squad was their third movie because WB execs have wanted a villain style dirty dozen out of a cast of DC supervillains for well over a decade. To the point they set up the Suicide Squad to spin out of the failed GL movie [hence the appearance by Waller]. Had we got the darker version of that film with 30 minutes more Joker and less special effects at the end, I think we as comic fans would've enjoyed it much more.

-00492

wrong order.

SHAZAM!
SUICIDE SQUAD 2!
JUSTICE LEAGUE DARK!
FLASHPOINT!
WONDER WOMAN 2!
GREEN LANTERN CORPS!
BATGIRL!
THE BATMAN

@Weird Tales

Ughhh...

I can already imagine how SHAZAM will turn out.

@Weird Tales I never got behind Shazam as a character. all I know is he was a kid in injustice 1 sueprman murdered in cold blood and hes a discount superman from what I can tell with that lightning bolt power.

@Weird Tales I never got behind Shazam as a character. all I know is he was a kid in injustice 1 sueprman murdered in cold blood and hes a discount superman from what I can tell with that lightning bolt power.

You really don't know the character

@Weird Tales

Ughhh...

I can already imagine how SHAZAM will turn out.

how? you can't see the future

@Weird Tales I never got behind Shazam as a character. all I know is he was a kid in injustice 1 sueprman murdered in cold blood and hes a discount superman from what I can tell with that lightning bolt power.

oh my what is this madness you speak of

<Snipped quote by Member 00492>

wrong order.

SHAZAM!
SUICIDE SQUAD 2!
JUSTICE LEAGUE DARK!
FLASHPOINT!
WONDER WOMAN 2!
GREEN LANTERN CORPS!
BATGIRL!
THE BATMAN

My list was quoted from the San Diego Comic Con in that order including JL followed by Aquaman, where was this one at? Batman is already well on its way to filming and you think its gonna come after GLC that has no writer, director, cast, etc. yet? It's not gonna take Reeves 3 1/2 years to make one Batman movie. Right now he's just waiting for the final script rewrites.

-00492

<Snipped quote by Archmage MC>

You really don't know the character

Nope, not at all. But then DC only does things with him in comics instead of other media besides a few episodes in JLU or that blue beetle show. (I remember something with that at some point, dunno if that was also JLU) so I don't know too much about him. But if hes not big enough to be seen in other media, he probably isn't that important anyway overall. All I know is he used to be Captain Marvel because DC hated Marvel or something, I dunno.

Also probably doesn't help they keep changing him over, and over, and over again.

Shazam is gonna be incredible because Dwayne 'the Rock' Johnson is playing Black Adam. Loki made Thor sell in the movies, it's gonna be more of that. Shazam originally wasn't gonna be part of the film universe but the execs changed their minds because the Rock wanted to deck Superman as Black Adam in a future crossover film.

To the point I think it's in his contract.

-00492

<Snipped quote by Weird Tales>

Nope, not at all. But then DC only does things with him in comics instead of other media besides a few episodes in JLU or that blue beetle show. (I remember something with that at some point, dunno if that was also JLU) so I don't know too much about him. But if hes not big enough to be seen in other media, he probably isn't that important anyway overall. All I know is he used to be Captain Marvel because DC hated Marvel or something, I dunno.

Also probably doesn't help they keep changing him over, and over, and over again.

He was Capt. Marvel in the 40's, Marvel didn't acquire rights to use the name until the 70's.

Shazam! was also a television series back in the late 70's early 80's much in the same vein as Linda Carter's WW. How's that for expanded media.

EDIT: In the 1940's he actually outsold Superman in comics, and was selling millions of copies back in the day when that was a huge number [shit it's a huge number today, top comics only selling around 200k a month]. This is why DC sued Fawcett Comics claiming CM was a copy of Superman [black hair, cape, flight, super strength] and eventually bought them outright some time later.

-00492

Shazam is gonna be incredible because Dwayne 'the Rock' Johnson is playing Black Adam. Loki made Thor sell in the movies, it's gonna be more of that. Shazam originally wasn't gonna be part of the film universe but the execs changed their minds because the Rock wanted to deck Superman as Black Adam in a future crossover film.

To the point I think it's in his contract.

-00492

That sounds really neat. Maybe with this movie they'll FINALLY decide what they wanna do with the character too.

<Snipped quote by Archmage MC>

He was Capt. Marvel in the 40's, Marvel didn't acquire rights to use the name until the 70's.

Shazam! was also a television series back in the late 70's early 80's much in the same vein as Linda Carter's WW. How's that for expanded media.

-00492

He was still called Captain Marvel in JLU. I dunno, I still see him as a discount superman based on his design and everything I see him do minus the lightning bolt.

<Snipped quote by Weird Tales>

Nope, not at all. But then DC only does things with him in comics instead of other media besides a few episodes in JLU or that blue beetle show. (I remember something with that at some point, dunno if that was also JLU) so I don't know too much about him. But if hes not big enough to be seen in other media, he probably isn't that important anyway overall. All I know is he used to be Captain Marvel because DC hated Marvel or something, I dunno.

Also probably doesn't help they keep changing him over, and over, and over again.

No they don't change him. Again you're making statements that make come off as being ignorant and an internet fanboy

<Snipped quote by Archmage MC>

No they don't change him. Again you're making statements that make come off as being ignorant and an internet fanboy

Yeah, its pretty clear I don't know who or what the character is or what hes used for. But even looking at Afros character which is I'm guessing based of of Shazam, hes still a discount superman with a bit of magic thrown in. If you wanna elaborate I'll listen as my knowledge of the guy, like I said, is limited to what he did in JLU and Brave and the Bold.

For the last 50 years, since Marvel acquired rights to the name Captain Marvel, DC couldn't use the name on the covers of their comics or in titles of movies and animation. He could still be called Capt. Marvel in the books and cartoons, they just couldn't promote it on covers or anything with the name.

Power of Shazam was an excellent series in the 90's. I'd rather go back to a title name like that than actually saying his name is Shazam now. I *think* he hasn't shown up post-Rebirth because they're gonna fix him before the movie comes out. I'd say piss all over Marvel, and since they made Black Marvel and Blue Marvel... let Billy Batson take the alias Red Marvel.

-00492

<Snipped quote by Weird Tales>

Yeah, its pretty clear I don't know who or what the character is or what hes used for. But even looking at Afros character which is I'm guessing based of of Shazam, hes still a discount superman with a bit of magic thrown in. If you wanna elaborate I'll listen as my knowledge of the guy, like I said, is limited to what he did in JLU and Brave and the Bold.

He is by no means a 'discount' Superman. Is he inspired by Superman, certainly--many characters of the time were influenced by Superman. A similar trend happened in video games in the eighties and nineties pertaining to martial arts characters and their homages to Bruce Lee. In every video game from the fighting genre in the nineties there was at least one character who was clearly based off Bruce Lee (Mortal Kombat is the worst offender).

I am wondering what you mean by 'discount' Superman, because his entire backstory is different. I won't explain it, you should read it. Billy's personality isn't even the same as Superman, considering Billy is a child and quite immature. He is certainly more comedic and less brooding than Superman. If we're talking solely about powers, Billy is on par with Superman and perhaps exceeds him ever so slightly given the magic.

I come home to find a whole bunch of new posts, only to find nothing related to the thread just DC movie talk. Now me sad.

My 2 cents: Supes and Bars ruin their movies. Wonder Woman and Suicide Squad were awesome. Suicide Squad had to much Bats.

Suicide Squad was a mess. Some great characters but it was just sloppy and it felt it. Hard to watch.

Also, a general discussion about DC property and The Justice League Movie doesn't feel 'unrelated' to a DC/Justice League RP.