Hidden 6 yrs ago 6 yrs ago Post by POOHEAD189
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@POOHEAD189 Yo man, go look it up. There are scientific facts and shit. Totally legit.


Ken, we got the big boys talking here, alright? The greatest minds of RPGuild in one thread to cultivate the most profound questions known to mankind. Like how many people attended Trump's inauguration, is it playing God to give basic medical care, how tall are sexi boiz, and is climate change just a Chinese conspiracy?
Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by AlteredTundra
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@POOHEAD189 First off, Climate Change was invented by the Hawaiians to offset the supsicions from their volcano gods that they weren't using authentic seaweed for their cooking. Sexi boiz are naturally short. You'd know this if you read your TheOnion articles. And as for God giving medical care, what do you think the gift of Christ is for? It certainly isn't there so it can waste away, or else he would've died for nothin, my dude.
Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by POOHEAD189
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@POOHEAD189 First off, Climate Change was invented by the Hawaiians to offset the supsicions from their volcano gods that they weren't using authentic seaweed for their cooking. Sexi boiz are naturally short. You'd know this if you read your TheOnion articles. And as for God giving medical care, what do you think the gift of Christ is for? It certainly isn't there so it can waste away, or else he would've died for nothin, my dude.

*Strokes chin* Compelling thesis. How did you acquire such vast knowledge?
Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by AlteredTundra
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<Snipped quote by Altered Tundra>
*Strokes chin* Compelling thesis. How did you acquire such vast knowledge?


I thought of it just now. Then I typed it and hit Post Reply.
Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by POOHEAD189
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I thought of it just now. Then I typed it and hit Post Reply.

So you just bullshitted?
...
Welcome to the thread!
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Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by AlteredTundra
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<Snipped quote by Altered Tundra>
So you just bullshitted?
...
Welcome to the thread!


Why thank you. You'll come to find that I am the master of bullshitting my way through debates.
Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by POOHEAD189
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<Snipped quote by POOHEAD189>

Why thank you. You'll come to find that I am the master of bullshitting my way through debates.

*looks at the past 215 pages* Like I said, you'll fit right in!
Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by Silver Carrot
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For real though, diet coke is less healthy for me than full-sugar classic coke because my body does not cope well with aspartame.
Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by The Harbinger of Ferocity
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@Xandrya

No, I am not saying you need to believe in said greater plan, I am merely pointing out that if one is going to critique a religion that they should probably set aside their personal feelings on it and weigh it by its merits. I personally find that a surrender of one's wants and desires to a greater system that benefits more people in a system of faith is for the better; this is where one also needs to assume God is both benevolent and all powerful. Even if that were not the case in either situation it is still a superior outcome to the raw, meaningless chaos that awaits the extreme opposite end of the pool, or the utter incompetency and inability of any system built by man.

I disagree that he could not somehow be both, namely because I ascribe to understanding the philosophy that if you are granted free will, which you are, that power to choose wrong rather than following what should be done then there is inevitably going to be fallout that affects others. It is not God who is sacrificing anyone or anything, rather it is the ongoing result of actions undertaken by people, many of whom even if they believe are not willing to follow; this is to as well utterly ignore the question of evil and its all consuming desire to destroy, which is another component to argue altogether. Nevertheless, while it might hurt you that said children lost their lives "just so you could go to work on time" it is ignorant to claim it was all about you, that somehow in such a system it would not or could not lead to more positives than negatives. Continued, your personal comfort and consolation are not the end goal, concerns perhaps, but the larger picture to be framed greatly eclipses your discomfort. In short, the ending state is unfathomably more important than your opinion in the context of a system that includes the Plan of God.

I need pose this, because so many argue this exact same issue, but in the entire story that focuses upon redemption and forgiveness what good would it do to instantly solve the world's problems? For one, it would violate the choice that is considered such a tremendous factor - others here mentioned it about the choice of seeking Jesus and Christianity as a whole, in addition to what a true death is - that being choice and another is, is that is indeed more or less promised. The issue people take with it is that they want it to be here and now, they want it to be their generation where the judgment comes and all terrible things are destroyed once and for all. Realistically, even if one ascribes to that for themselves, they need recognize that it was explicitly stated no man would now when; you'd have your wish yet, just not when or how known to you.

Righteous by human definition is only proof enough that people are more worried about what is good for the human being rather than all things played out in consideration. It is as though they think they were promised that everything would be good rather than being told that God is good. You could argue, as you have, that he cannot be both based upon evidence around us, but again that is not taking the entire scenario and the context of the faith's system into understanding. It was not promised to be easy, the contrary was assured, and the book itself is rife with conflicts, injustice and lack of righteousness that all stem from mankind. At times they were used by God, others by Satan, but a large portion is people more or less proving to be self-defeating.

Finally, if those people choose not to find peace and forgive Bob for being obviously a sick man in mind, as well as spirit, I am afraid I cannot extend my sympathies there other than what is due. People are asked to forgive the unforgivable and set themselves aside from themselves; to cling to it is not their business and not what is asked of them. Again, I must state and affirm that it is not about what the person wants it is about what needs to be done. I admit, from my eyes I do not understand the issue in letting go and instead accepting it is not my place to judge the lives of men. The notion people hold that it is their duty is completely alien to me, for if example Bob did surrender himself for forgiveness and was forgiven clearly the already greater power has that greater understanding of sincerity that people's human emotional tendencies interfere with.

And in the end, Bob would never know until he was already dead. As the phrase goes, "Let God sort them out."
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Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by Dolerman
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<Snipped quote by POOHEAD189>

Why thank you. You'll come to find that I am the master of bullshitting my way through debates.


Looks like MDK has a new rival.
Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by SleepingSilence
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Aspartame used to give me a migraine. Diet coke especially. Clearly not anymore, since all I drink is diet pop now. But I've seen some baffling arguments against diet pop. There's an asinine argument saying it would make you gain weight faster than normal pop, because it assumes the person drinking is such a fat stupid bastard. They'd think 0 calories in pop means they can eat even more food now and that's how they get fatter. <.<

I could go on forever on dieting and how badly the internet will fuck you up, if you take half the shit it says trying to give you advice seriously...there's a fucking video about like starving yourself "fastening" for days and days at a time to get "healthy" weight loss. >.>

@Altered Tundra You're a stand-up philosopher?
Hidden 6 yrs ago 5 yrs ago Post by Polymorpheus
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Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by Xandrya
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@The Harbinger of Ferocity

I see what you mean, to be honest. In my opinion, religion asks so much more than it gives, that it isn't even a matter of choice for me. I went to church for years, and not once did I feel a "presence". The only reason I attended for a decade and a half was because my mom really wanted me to go, so that's what I did.

But I'd really be fine with the whole thing if it didn't try to barge in the lives of others. Or rather, be used for that purpose. That's even more of a reason for the burden of proof to be on them, not us, as it should already be anyway.
Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by SleepingSilence
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@Xandrya I didn't want to jump in this discussion, because I didn't have much to add. But if I can answer that through a religious lense. Honestly, the idea of the corrupt nature of church or not feeling a presence there. Could easily go hand and hand. Not to preach, but you usually can't find something if you never intended to seek it. (You admit you only went to please your family. You never wanted to seek spiritually.) Church isn't how you have a relationship with god, at least as Christian's are concerned...

And on a non-religious answer, in modern times Christianity has given far more than it's taken. Especially through charities. I've always seen this online about Christian's barging into people's life with ideas. But I really don't see Christians doing any of barging in people lives, often I see atheists doing it. I certainly find many atheists struggling to be consistent with their dislike of religion when anything other than Catholicism is brought up. Not stating anything personal mind, but comments like "god has to be uncaring because rapists exist/god can't exist because bad things happen" are so bog-standard teenage atheist philosophy 101, that you can't get anywhere discussing religion, spirituality, faith and whatever else.
Hidden 6 yrs ago 6 yrs ago Post by Xandrya
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@SleepingSilence

But that's the thing, I actually went in with the belief that there was a god. I mean, looking back at it all my mother started taking me to services when I was like 8 or 9. Given my non-American background, prior to switching over to Christianity, my parents and I were regular members of the Catholic Church as was the default for just about everyone else in my small town. I was born into a religious family and community. Not once, not through my childhood nor well into adolescence and eventually adulthood, did I experience this supernatural entity or whatever they claim. I kept my faith because others told me it was real and that I would go to hell otherwise, so I believed in the religion and I prayed occasionally, etc. But nothing ever came out of it, not a single sign.

That's my personal experience. I am semi open against religion because it isn't something that's kept in the church as it should be. It's ingrained in the American government, despite the fact that the U.S. was not founded on Christianity. So yes, for as long as they can remember, Christianity has been injected into our lives whether we like it or not. IIRC, there are 7 states where atheists can't hold office. You have to be religious to work in the government, so when someone mentions religious persecution, I can't help but laugh. When gay marriage became legal, it wasn't an attack on Christianity, it was a move forward to let other people who have absolutely no influence on your life or your ability to get into to heaven, to live the way they want. Why? Because they are a citizen of the U.S., not the United States of Christianity.

People will always talk smack, so I try not to pay them any mind as they don't matter. But just look at the history of U.S. Presidents and tell me there's an actual attack on Christianity. If the government and the highest office held in the land is based on Christianity and it has always been like that, then what is there to worry about? People who don't necessarily abide by the religion? Once more, that's not an attack, but just an attempt to have the same rights as you and me.

There may be atheists right this second attempting to overthrow Trump and hold every U.S. citizen hostage, who knows. If that is the case, then I'll gladly admit I was wrong as hell.

EDIT: Forgot to add, I meant religion doesn't give back in a metaphorical way. Like, I didn't get anything out of it. Am I still alive? Sure, but I mean, so are millions of other non-Christians. Again, that's just my personal experience and they by no means reflect the experience of others.
Hidden 6 yrs ago 6 yrs ago Post by SleepingSilence
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@Xandrya Well I can't say what you did or didn't believe, when you're younger it's sort of hard to really have any perception on life. Religion doesn't really mean much to most kids, because they just don't know better. Their beliefs are heavily influenced by the love or hate toward their parents. Though I don't think judging either/or if nothing is actively hurting society. I find Catholicism has many problems, but it's problems with the people themselves.

But if you're someone who actively wants to fight the fight against religion, Muslims/The Quran are the actual problem. I'd like to see more religiously motivated atheists not tuck the tails between their legs and be just as venomous, if not more so. Though I rarely see such proclamations. But that's just me spit-balling.

Though if I can point out a correction, America absolutely did get founded on Christian ideals. (I don't disagree about gay marriage being progress, though the fabric of american society is hanging by a thread from the slippery slope fallacy becoming tangible and running rampant. There's so many examples I hope I don't need to spend time clarifying.)

heritage.org/political-process/report…
Hidden 6 yrs ago 6 yrs ago Post by POOHEAD189
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Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by Xandrya
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@SleepingSilence

I wasn't a kid when I left the church, I was 25, maybe 26. I had a firm grasp on my beliefs (or lack thereof) at the time and a few years later, nothing's changed.

And I believe that atheists (at least here) aren't as outspoken regarding Islam because it's not the main religion running the country. Sure, it's one hell of a problem in many other nations, but not here. Atheists in, let's say, Saudi Arabia sure do try to fight their battle, but then they get killed. Atheists here battle the main religion, Christianity. Not as huge of a problem as Islam, but let's not kid ourselves, we're not living in Sweden or any of those glorious countries where they don't gotta worry about anything.

You see, religion is a lot like sports. You're born in America, you're more than likely to be Christian and a football fan. You're born in Japan, the chances of you being Buddhist and a fan of baseball (they love it there) are damn high. It's all situational. And the beliefs continue on to adulthood. They believe what their parents and society tells them to, not what they feel is right. I'm not saying that's the case for every single person, but the ones that go against the flow are a few and far in between.

As far as the origin of the US, I mean yeah "thou shalt not kill" and so on. I'm not religious but I don't go around murdering people. Christian ideals, sure, but not necessarily the Christian religion itself. It's written in the Treat of Tripoli (Article 11). It was just over a half century ago that "God" was implemented into the pledge and IIRC, currency as well. It wasn't always like this.
Hidden 6 yrs ago 6 yrs ago Post by SleepingSilence
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@Xandrya

(I probably shouldn't get too deep into discussion when my back is as sore as it is, distracts me from making points as well as I could.)

So you went to church since you were 8 with your family (catholic church?) and you kept going to the very same church, even though you never believed until you were 25? That seems a little strange to me, especially if you're relatively opposed to it for the whole/most of the time. I stopped going to church with my family the very first time, it got into an argument that my parents vehemently disagreed with as Christians. I guess, it's really hard to get into personal experience and faith really is just something more personal and can't really be pushed on anyone. (Though, I honestly never felt the appeal of the church either.)

I don't disagree that atheists in america treat Christianity like there's some kind of war to be won. But I feel like it's antithetical to the idea of not wanting to impose your beliefs on others. There isn't discrimination towards non-christian's in law. Honestly the idea a certain group is ruling the world and that's why they need to be taken to task, really feels like some "Jews run the world" type of stuff. Not saying that your implying such, in anyway. But I just don't see people happening to be religious, like most of Americans claim to be, automatically a problem, if no actual harm is coming from it.

I'd absolutely disagree that it's not a problem here, and if not dealt with elsewhere it certainly will become one here. (Some want sharia law in america and no go zones are starting to become a danger. For instance.)

centerforsecuritypolicy.org/2015/06/2…
Hidden 6 yrs ago 6 yrs ago Post by mdk
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You see, religion is a lot like sports. You're born in America, you're more than likely to be Christian and a football fan. You're born in Japan, the chances of you being Buddhist and a fan of baseball (they love it there) are damn high. It's all situational. And the beliefs continue on to adulthood. They believe what their parents and society tells them to, not what they feel is right. I'm not saying that's the case for every single person, but the ones that go against the flow are a few and far in between.


Not trying to banter or insert myself or whatever, just.... Reaching the same conclusions as your parents does not imply a lack of independent thought. "Ones that go against the flow" are no more (and no less) thoughtful than "ones who don't." An absolute moron can rebel, and a wunderkind genius who spends every minute of every day in rapt study, can concur. The ends are no indicator of the means.

And btw, no judgments from me on either the moron or the genius. If you assume there is a higher power then they're both stupidby comparison; and if there isn't, then their intellectual investment is irrelevant. I'm of the opinion that truly great minds wouldn't bother with the debate in the first place, because ultimately (in any religion or lack thereof) intellect doesn't enter the eternal equation.

That said I'll debate it all day, fite me. I'm just another moron clinging to guns and religion.

.....guess I am inserting myself, fuck. Whatever. Bourbon is fantastic.
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