Ammokkx

Why Is No One Joining My RP (General Advice Thread)

someone post already

@fledermaus

I already threw in the towel. Please, no more.

Why Is No One Joining My RP (General Advice Thread)

Just wanted to chime in and ask if anyone else has a good ass answer for

"what does success mean for me as a GM/RPer"

At some point I want to edit in a few of the answers for that to the OP.

@BangoSkank

Are you telling me my answer wasn't quote-worthy? Bango... how could you do this to me?

Success as a GM is getting players to post, like, at all. That's a serious answer, if you need it. The GM's job, in my mind, is to make a fun adventure for the players. I struggle with this concept, like, a lot. As long as people are posting, or at the very least want to post, I am doing my job right. If they do not want to engage with the story, I have done something wrong and need to change my approach.

Why Is No One Joining My RP (General Advice Thread)

Well at least you deigned to grace me with a rebuttal this time so I can actually have a conversation with you on your viewpoints. That being said, I tire of this just as much as you do. I'm going to go as in-depth as I can with this post as to why your way of thinking is flawed. If, after this post, you still remain unconvinced, then there is nothing me or anyone else is ever going to be able to do to you to help you. You might as well never ask for help or complain about anything ever again at that point, because nothing anyone can say to you will allow you to step over the hurdles you face. Also, I don't want to get this any more off-topic than I have.

@Ammokkx
It didn't feel like you were "genuine" on that help attempt

@rebornfan320

You know what? You're right. I am aggressive and off-putting. And, in the status bar, I was especially set on slamming some good dunks as I shitpost on that thing more than I do actually talk to people. But over here, each of my posts have had advice and critique not hidden beneath a veneer of snark. If you cannot take them as efforts to help you, then my words have no way to reach you to begin with. Even my "Then you have no reason to be in this thread" is an honest statement. As others have said, you are not acting like someone who wants help. You come across as wanting people to wallow in your pity. Again, I don't say this because I dislike you, I say this because it is what your words look like to other people. Make of it what you feel like making of it.

@Ammokkx
it sure felt like a attack on me and my stance on things from my viewpoint as you came off to me like anyone else, they didn't understand my viewpoint and came off rather rudely.

@rebornfan320

What it "feels" like to you isn't what it is. Death of the author may be a thing, but you're the only one that seems to share in the sentiment. No, I do understand your viewpoint. I may not be able to relate to a bunch of 1x1 posters ghosting me, of course, due to my penchant for group RPs... or can I?

Let me tell you, I was 13 at a time. 13 year old Ammokkx was on Tumblr, hosting an RP blog. Tumblr RPs are 1x1. I had a bunch of partners and, yes, I did get ghosted. It felt like I was being ignored. I tried so desperately hard to get people's attention but it seemed like nobody wanted to RP with me. At the time, I didn't understand why.

But in retrospect, I saw that I was insufferable to those around me. I powergame'd. My OC's were mary sues. I was a huge dick to people. I'm amazed I still have friends from that era at all, but the long and short is that I was very much the cause of my own downfall... in hindsight. I didn't see it at the time, and you do not seem to see it now. I understand how you feel, Reborn. Everyone understands how you feel. Feel free to not believe us if you like. But know this; It is because we know how you feel that we are giving this advice in the hope that those feelings push you to be better than you are. Even if many have given up hope to that end.

I feel it is more of my partners than myself because of them always ghosting and poofing off on me without any sort of warning or heads up whatsoever.

@rebornfan320

This is a problem that you're far from the only person who faces it. In fact, if you ask around, I'm sure you can find some people with 1x1 blacklists of notorious ghosters. Hell, I have a semi-official blacklist for group RPers with a penchant for ghosting. Those people do exist, but if you cannot hold a single RP? If you cannot retain a single friend? Please, Reborn. Please tell me you don't genuinely believe that there must not at least be the tiniest thing wrong with your approach if everyone treats you the same way. If you can only draw that crowd. I refuse to believe you are this blind to a simple matter of fact.

There's a crude idiom for this that rings true nevertheless. "If it smells like shit everywhere you go, check underneath your soles."

I do feel like a target whenever I speak up on something that frustrates me as I expect I have to defend myself against a mob mentality and I got to fight against everyone else just to feel like I am getting through to people or even understood.

@rebornfan320

The reason it feels this way is because the thing you are complaining about, the very thing that sparked this thread, is something I have called you out on in the past. You keep complaining about the same thing, and people keep telling you the same things. You then proceed to ignore what everyone tells you and do the thing you were previously doing, all the while complaining about the same subject again. You know the quote from Farcry 3? "Definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting different results" and all that? I feel it applies here. It is only a mob mentality because we have done this same song and dance time and again. If you go back and read your old threads, people were kind to you when you first asked. Even when you asked again, a third time, even in the post I called you out on! But then you keep doing it again, and again, and again.

At some point, we grew sick of hearing the same story. If you have nothing new to say, if you have no other insights... then, quite frankly, none of us want to hear it. I'm sorry. If you consider this to be mobbing, then the mob is never going to end. You choose to keep bringing this up, so we push back.

I don't see how what I am doing is wrong in retrospect when I look at it, I am doing my hardest to even get interest and any advice hasn't worked or stuck as effective or long as I expect you know?

@rebornfan320

I do know. I really do. While not the exact same, I have trouble retaining interests in my RPs. People just don't want to post after a while when I GM. I am desperately looking for the source of the issue, even when I can't find anything I am doing wrong. It is an ongoing struggle and it is a flaw I am all too aware of. It is why I have an aversion to GMing, it sucks! But I don't blame other people for it, you know? I don't turn it into a "me vs. them" issue. I never blame my players for losing interest, I look inside of myself and think "What could I have done better in hindsight? How could I apply this to my next idea going forward?"

I take huge breaks in between GMing for this very reason. It is, quite frankly, not fun to have something crash and burn, nor is it fun to have something which was once so lively be on life support at the end of its days. But I always had a part to play in that. You do too.

I feel like this “olive branch” could be like those other times and just filled with empty promises of things getting better for me when my luck and experience has shown me completely different. Like how am I supposed to trust the advice when the advice before failed?

@rebornfan320

But have you truly applied the advice? When we ask you to add colour or image, you reject it vehemently. When we say you aren't too pleasant of a person to talk to, you disagree and deny it. To me, at least, it doesn't look like you're actually applying any advice at all. But you don't have to take my word for it. Ask one of the nicer people to coach you, to run through the motions with you. But you have to understand that you will have to make changes to the way you do things. If they tell you "do this" then you do it, no questions asked. You don't push back. You don't fight it. The moment you fight it, you prove that you don't want to be helped.

I will not claim to know things better than you. But there are people that can claim as such. Listen to them. Listen. Don't argue.

It's like I always have to fight for my voice and side to be even remotely heard I feel most times.

@rebornfan320

No, Reborn. We hear your voice. We understand your side. You have made it loud and clear. But nobody agrees with your perspective and we're not going to start any time soon. What we see out of you, the vast majority of us, runs counter to the narrative you try to spin. At that point you need to ask; if everyone in the world is crazy except for the one sane man, is the one sane man truly sane? In that same respect, if literally everybody tells you the opposite of what you tell yourself, is your perspective truly the right one? My answer, as you can guess, is no. Yours should be no too, but it is up to you to recognize that.

That's it. That's my final post for this thread, or at least, on the subject of your personal failures. Do with it as you wish. If you don't want to listen to what I have to say, then I have nothing I can say to you.

Why Is No One Joining My RP (General Advice Thread)

Oh, also, @rebornfan320, I don't mind if you dislike me on a personal level. That's fine, that's fair. But do notice that the things I am saying are not being said in a vacuum. I am mainly echoing what others have said, and the fact at least 1 or more people deign to leave a reaction on my posts should show that the words I say are sentiments echoed by not just me. It's fine if you don't want to take my words seriously, but if that is the case, I implore you to read them as if someone else who dropped a reaction on them had posted them.

Despite what you may think, I am genuinely trying to help you. The problem is that you need to first recognize the faults of your failures do not lie with your partners, but with you. I am sorry if this is painful, I am sorry if you have trouble believing that but it is the undisputable truth of the matter. Until you accept this and do some introspection, as well as be a bit more humble towards others, I fear that you will continue to fail time and time again.

Regardless of what any single individual here may feel about you, and regardless of what you may feel about them, each and every single one of us are trying to help you in some way. The best result, for all of us, is that you open your eyes to the errors of your ways and start actually engaging with the community on a level they are comfortable with rather than what you wish out of them. You will find us more receptive to you, and you more receptive to us, if you make an active effort to fix the problems we have pointed out to you multiple times.

My apologies for being rude to you at times, truly, but this olive branch we extend to you is going to wither and die eventually if you do not reach out and wrap your hand around it.

Why Is No One Joining My RP (General Advice Thread)

@Tuujaimaa Well like you said it is a fair question to ask. My answer and reply to you is that I don't think my viewpoint is incorrect based on the experiences I had and feel like I need to defend myself from people that never gone through the pain to me of having the amount of RP's dead within a year at all.

@rebornfan320

Then you should not be in this thread as you do not think you are doing anything wrong.

Why Is No One Joining My RP (General Advice Thread)

Well 'dishonorable' isn't weird to me when I look at it. I look at it and your word as someone has said it, you should be more than capable to back it up also.

@rebornfan320

It might not be weird to you, but other people think it's a strange way to put it. At the very least the more common terminology would be "being a dick" or just, y'know, "ghosting" as it is. Ghosting isn't a good thing, it's inherently negative. Stacking "dishonorable" on top of it sounds like you're talking about how someone violated the samurai code. Corrosive said it best: Honor is a personal thing. It's a value each of us has to weigh for ourselves individually, and you can't force your sense of "honor" onto somebody else. To another person it is meaningless, and they are under no obligation to feel the same way as you.

My viewpoint would disagree with 'everybody' having a lack of interest on their part or even to the levels of my bad RP luck.

@rebornfan320

Everyone has slumps. I've posted in threads before that didn't get interest or died because of too little. Here's one that got very few hits and thus the GM didn't feel it worth to start it up. It happens.

Well I have to be guarded because whenever I have done put myself out there before there was little or even no interest for it and I have kept trying before but it felt like a waste of energy and effort

@rebornfan320

Being guarded gets you nowhere. This is a social hobby and if you can't be open to the other person you're never going to get anywhere. That being said, I'm reading you being defensive rather than guarded, which is equally bad for a different reason. If you can't take pushback from what someone else tells you, you are never going to find a partner, as people will disagree with you. If you bite back in an overly defensive manner, instead of being humble about the critique you're given, people will be put off by your attitude and won't want to RP with you. This has bitten me in the ass quite a few times (idk if ambra even remembers it but I sure do remember a scuffle with her at some point).

as at my max in terms of effort I wasn't seeing the payout I expected for myself.

@rebornfan320

Don't expect anything for yourself. You are not owed a single thing by anyone else; the only thing you can do is up your game and try again. If that fails, try something different. If you're not going to try something different, then expect the same results unless you get lucky at some point.

I feel it is a war against those who are dedicated and in their way are dishonorable ghosters. I don't see their actions as 'moving on' at all. I can't justify someone doing that to another person.

@rebornfan320

Lastly, this "me vs. them" mentality isn't going to get you anywhere. People ghost for three primary reasons:

1: Something in real life came up that makes them not want to deal with the stress of RPing so they vanish without a trace.
2: The plot you've laid out with them isn't interesting them no more and thus they leave
3: You've gotten bad blood with the other person and so they leave because they don't want to be around you as an individual.

The ghoster is not without fault, as they will fail to express any single one of these, naturally. The second one can even be entirely their whims, however, 1,5 of these reasons have you as a personal involvement. If RPs keep failing with you, specifically, and others are finding success, then I'm sorry to say this but you're going to need to change something about your approach or the way you talk to people. I have learned to keep my mouth firmly shut in 90% of cases where I have an issue with someone else's character or post, unless the group has made explicitly clear they're okay with me doing so or the problem is too big to ignore. In case of the latter, I have parted ways with multiple groups because the issues compounded too harshly for me to stay.

Take a look at the advice given in this thread. Compare to what you are doing. Don't go "Everyone else is the problem" since a repeated pattern of failure means a flaw in the process. Something is going to need to change on your end, whether you accept that or not. Failing to change also means failing to see any results beyond what you've been seeing.

Whether it's your personality, reputation, interest checks, quality of writing or any combination of such... something's gotta give.

Why Is No One Joining My RP (General Advice Thread)

"what does success mean for me as a GM/RPer"

@BangoSkank

when i'm not in it

Why Is No One Joining My RP (General Advice Thread)

If we're gonna take this thread seriously for a moment;

I've been in the GM's seat give or take 4 times now, to varying degrees of success. I've always gotten past the interest check phase but beyond that I've had quite... varied results.

I've found that in order to have a good interest check, you need to have at least some elements (but not all) of the following (and I definitely have left some gaps but oh well):

• Being able to clearly articulate your idea. You may have the best ideas in the world, but if you can't properly explain what it's about then you're not going to get anywhere.
• Doing something that people are both asking for, and others aren't providing. This one's a bit more abstract, but what it comes down to is this: Interest for a generic fantasy adventure is always high, but if your adventure is too generic, and there's 3 other RPs already on the market dealing with the same thing, people are going to be playing in those instead.
• Knowing what you want. This isn't the same as having a detailed idea, mind. I've gotten away with posting an interest check titled "let's brainstorm a yugioh roleplay together" and I sure did draw a crowd from it (even if, when it got time to actual writing, it all fell apart). Thing is, even in that brainstorm thread I still laid out a few fundamental things I was looking for. Close to the anime, none o' dat meta shit, a lot of freedom in how duels unfolded (so no simulators). The details of the actual plot was for everyone interested to figure out together. This, too, was made clear. Set your boundaries and stick to them.
• Putting effort into presentation. I'm not saying "use colours, tables, images and gifs like your life depends on it" since, really, I don't do that either. But do try to format your text in a clearly readable, easily accessible manner. Organizing your thread to have a clear beginning-middle-end structure and making sure it has at least some logical chronology to it goes a loooong way.

That being said, what I just wrote only really applies to specifically group RPs. I've not much interest nor experience in 1x1's, though I did, somehow, get a few hits on my rather poor attempt at a 1x1 check (can find it in my profile if curious). None of which went anywhere, mind, since I had no real chemistry with anyone who approached me, but it's an interesting footnote nonetheless. Wouldn't recommend taking it as a good example of how2intcheck though.

Why Is No One Joining My RP (General Advice Thread)

Bango I don't think starting this thread was a good idea

Secundi Lux

---

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Chie was quiet and observant, as is her nature. She exchanged pleasantries well enough when prompted, but her focus was dedicated to learning about the other three rather than them getting to know her. They were nice. Conversation between the four of them was a constant, even if the subjects themselves barely held any kind of importance. Chie did, however, learn where her fellow Ars Magi-to-be all came from. Crystal hailed from Norba, Selma's past lay with Hasta and Rivka had made her home in Baeterrae. Nova Lux scouted the four girls from every corner of the world, it seemed like. Maybe there would be even more kinds of people waiting at the academy itself.

Her musings had to take a backseat when captain Wei informed all of them that they'd be getting off soon, another change of travel plans being made. It made Chie uneasy. Was the attack so severe? She didn't notice anything amiss before all this, but she couldn't help but worry for the safety of the people she left behind just over half an hour ago. It made her shift uncomfortably in her seat. Looking away from the rest of them. Distracting herself by watching the lights flicker by. She stopped thinking about the other three, forgot they were even there.

When it was time to step out of the railcar, Chie had found the atmosphere just as unsettling. Calcaria's railways were bustling during the day and she didn't have much experience with this dark, barren wasteland stretching out in front of her. She wasn't used to how dark everything was, to see people so silent and distant. Even though they had the military escorting them, somehow, it felt like something would jump out of the shadows at them. Some kind of void that slipped through, somehow, and was aiming for them specifically. A ridiculous thought, surely.

Instead, it wasn't ridiculous enough.

Chie felt some kind of impact, sudden and violent, throwing her back. Her ears were ringing, her vision went black and she was too shocked to move her limbs. She tried to get her bearings on the surroundings, but everything spun and moved. Her body hurt. In a daze she weakly tried to move her arm, but found it stuck on something. Same result with the other one. Then, Chie noticed the reason why. Something was dragging her. Clarity shot through Chie, as did panic. Some manner of void must have bust through. They were going to drag her off and kill her, like... like they...

"G-GET OFF! LET ME GO!" she hysterically yelled, struggling and thrashing in the grip of her captors. She didn't know the truth of the matter, of course, and it's not like she could do much. Whoever, or whatever had her in its grip also strongly overpowered her. "H-help! HELP ME!" she continued her panicked shouting. It was all she could do.