Fallenreaper

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@Fallenreaper Another player's

@Rilla

Ah, noted for the future.

Arena Chat Thread

In coming wall of text, and I tried to condensed it but I was enjoying the conversations a bit too much.

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Exactly my thoughts I couldn't agree more.

@GreivousKhan

I see.

<Snipped quote by MelonHead>

I actually made a test format in OLDguild with that 5v5 that laid witness to the tragic horse incident of 2013, and have been thinking about remaking one for this guild complete with a basic class system of sorts. That mostly follows the TVtrops of Glass Canon and The Wall, etc, thus making characters allot more balanced overall, rather then them ending up with prefect strength, speed, and endurance.

@GreivousKhan

I'm not familiar with those TVtrops. I usually end up comparing my stats using real world examples that people could likely understand or get an idea of, namely say you know which is obviously stronger when it comes to someone with say bear strength vs someone has enough power to deadlift a small truck or two over head. Though I am guilty of ignoring key stat levels in favor of making it a good battle until it can't be or it's a weakness. Namely as most fights are never an actual ram fight (aka, lock horns and push) but mostly who can trap their opponent first.

The stat types I mentioned are also easily researchable or could have links supplied, along with the actually determined number mention. That's a factor which is missing when it comes to actually understanding and putting stats against each other, not to mention what influences affect strength and speed. I never realized, until Yosh explained it to me, about three key factors that can affect a hit's strength which is something not many newbies will put or take in account. That it's not just force but weigh, balance and other aspects to keep in mind. In some cases, getting more interest for some is merely as simple as doing some of the work for them to show them how. These are aspect missing currently to me which while it's great to ask others, people like to be less dependent and have better examples to use for their own attempts.

*One thing I think would be helpful is a link library or list of acceptable textual and number stats ranges for strength, speed, stamina and whatever else at a normal human level that helps determine a PCs level. Also I think more technical guides to when it comes to what needs to be considered in determining how hard a hit is, effects of different terrain on speeds and mobility, how to keep your balance while tossing and receive a hit and etc. AT least for those who want to apply them to battle. Actually having arena fighters put out their own discoveries and experiences out there in tutorials or briefs would help establish the basics of realism, at least for me. Once the newbies have sources to understand that line then they can begin to break them much easier while still producing balances. It's hard to go beyond something you've literally never actually done or have the money/means to learn and some arena newbies could have little to no experience at all in real combat/fighting/martial arts/etc. Which this makes it hard to understand what the body is, and I mean really, capable of and myths that we're lead to believe by movies and stories.

Sadly, I'll keep repeating and stressing this until the cows come home as I was and still am in that damn boat. :P

Hopefully it will also prevent mini-maxing that Skalla managed, giving himself Godly in every skill set. >.>

Cause the gods forbid he make a character anyone has a chance against, but I digress. See where was this kind of feed back when I asked Chat months/weeks ago? I'll probably install in into the next 5v5 I do, and due to it being only Tier 1's as well as being a group match up (which people prefer going into if it's their first time it seems) it will be a prefect place for rookies to get their feet wet, if I can find the time with all the stuff going on.

@GreivousKhan

Not sure? I know when I looked back on the some of the threads, some of the discussion seemed to have been all over the place. Also I wasn't around until recently questioning and help energize things btw. Though I look forward to seeing it as it sounds ideal Khan and might help stir some rookies in the arena though one question... What if you can't get 10 rookies? Are you going to allow vets and more experienced fighters into that? Mainly so they can help teach the rookies physics? :p

Shots fired, but ultimately yeah I'd like to see balance in the form of -real- weaknesses and strengths in characters, like actual humans.

@MelonHead

*points to above statement, the one with the little asterisk*

While it doesn't comment on the statement, the idea in the * paragraph would likely benefit with a list of limitations for a human level which could slowly be peeled away and replaced with others as newbies stem from realism. In some instances, some weaknesses are suppose to be widely known but it always helps to have them reiterated for those who forget or haven't a clue about it. We're all human after all... unless one of you are secretly an Alien AI. *pauses and glances squinting eyes at each of you* Right?

My characters all have weaknesses Khan, you just need to learn how to fight.

@Skallagrim

Considering you have one loss... someone was able to stand up to your PC. Just not sure who and details of it. Though I have to agree with Khan, you have some powerful CSes and seriously intimidating pcs.

@Fallenreaper While it might be limiting and repeating, people tend to be different enough that, in theory, two people playing a fire type person could play them completely different. That would also make for a good fight. Using the same character to see how differently they are played. I did something similar with Luna, who used to RP here.

The thing about making a list is that there is always something forgotten. The basics are simple, basically, no extreme healing, teleportation, etc.

@Rilla

True but in some cases isn't that one aspect that actually brings individuals to the arena in the first place? For me it was a rather big one. Not to mention a muse might not be able to work within confined themes and that's punishing someone for something a bit out of their control. At least to me. However I'm not putting this together and I could be completely wrong, I don't know or will state I know everything. It could do exactly as you want it to but it could also not.

One thing that does likely need be done is defining as the basic realism and levels. No matter what, that needs to be established. Even if you just do human level because I've seen adrenaline (guilty of it in the past myself) be the 'super' boost that allows over the top shenanigans.

I have already pointed out about some people not fully understanding some aspects do affect key things. Unless you aim on everyone battling identical arenas? Then that wouldn't an issue and my last state on it is moot.

On the subject of Points, if I did make it with points, it would be similar to Bleach - Rising Stars, and focus more on

Strength, Speed, Magic Ability, Defense(split between magical and physical), and maybe intelligence or evasion/ or something, but stats aren't a good way to introduce people. The way I suggested, probably would be. As, personally, it keeps them from getting too fancy, which is where a lot of issues start.

@Rilla

True but I usually thought it was usually due to balance. Some people don't list weaknesses along with their strengths for fear of it being used against them in a match. Some don't have weaknesses equal to their strengths. Sadly, with me... It's a habit I try to level out my weaknesses and strengths, giving a bit more strengths than weaknesses. It's something I won't break or stop as without the listed weakness, the PC feels too op to me. Personally, that's why I listed them so they can be used since every match will never be exacting the same and just because you had a weakness listed doesn't mean my PC doesn't have a way to protect or is not aware of it. They wouldn't have 'survived' this long if they didn't know how to defend against people would use it and every case is different because no single match is ever the exact same.

Sorry for the wall, guys, I really am so don't kick my ass. >,<

Arena Chat Thread

How is what I said unfair? If a few people come here and want to run a game where they face a gm run monster fest and not each other that certainly doesn't match our ranked element. If they come and want to have a rapid, T2 style match, with canon characters with friends and not detailed posts that again doesn't match "our" elements. That is not to say they might not want to join later, but their initial reason is not to join our competative ranks.

@Skallagrim

It might've been the tone I read it in and apologies for that. It just sounded like it was meant in a negative way which felt unfair to me. And, apologies.

Arena Chat Thread

An introductory subforum would be nice if people used it to learn and become an active participant. Many come here with the idea of starting a thread and fighting any which way. Those people have an idea of what they want and when the community doesn't respond they leave. Those who step into the chat with an introduction vanish shortly after. It is a tough line because the arena denotes different things to different people.

@Skallagrim

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For reasons like this that I think we need some kind of Introductory subforum for people coming into the Arena here. A chance to really make sure everyone gets all the information they might need. Just expecting everyone to read every single thread with no real guidance on what they should and shouldn't bother to read is asking a bit much, I think. Also, It would offer a chance to post more relative threads. For example, I've been here for how long now? And I couldn't tell you where at in the Arena one could go and find the ruleset for T1. I mean, I'm sure it's there somewhere. I mean, I assume someone would have posted that by name. Perhaps even other rulesets.

@Impaqt

I actually... have saved rather a lot of threads, from preguild fall, saved into my flash drive. I think I even saved character sheets as well for reference in how some of the powers were explained, limited, etc. Namely as they helped a lot though they were varied for each player. Yes, if I like a CS I tend to draw aspects I like and such, as well as read them to see how detailed I should be in my own. Some of them were fairly well done.

There could be an area in the multiverse itself to train newcomers so they could participate in the multiverse, developing their characters while learning at the same time.

@ImportantNobody

Well, that would depend on a few factors. Namely how would you do that, like a sort of mentoring system or purely 'it's there so use it' tactics? The first, is an iffy one as I don't know the vet number or how dependable the newbies will be. You could have mentors that are too stressed to help teach newbies the ropes and ins and outs, while some newbies might up and vanish. However it has a better chance then the other. Mainly because in the 'it's there, so use it' tactics, you'll end up with Players often interacting alone or struggling to balance story telling and the arena aspect of it.

For me, I need a balance between normal rp and arena aspects. Usually the prior leaning into the latter resulting in a arena style fight then a lull for a while followed by another fight. I like to think of it as a sort of a plot of a novel. The fights are the raising actions, while there's normal rp leading up those points. It was one of the main reasons I enjoyed the arena was when Lyzan invited me into Insanity Isle with two friends of mine. It combined the two rp types nice and smoothly which allowed for conflict and story, increasing my enjoyment of the arena. It was namely a smooth transition from one to the other.

That only happens if they want to participate. If they want to start their own arena fight with friends they aren't interested in "our" arena elements.

@Skallagrim

That seems a bit unfair to me when you say it like that. Namely as I only battled with Lyzan, instead of joining the multiverse back before guildfall, in a pm because I knew him best. Some times comfort zone takes a higher position than risk to many people, like in my case before now. That didn't make what he taught different from your arena fights since they were the same basics. Mainly, the reason I stuck to only Lyzan because he was my friend and I wasn't afraid he would frown on my mistakes, get bothered by my questions, or get tired of teaching me. The same goes for Tearstone. I knew both would encourage me to think about my actions, sink into the scene and develop tactics outside the box. Especially no matter how unusual or unrealistic it was, and then explain to me several factors to increase my knowledge for the arena.

I think many reasons I frightened off opponents was because I asked details I considered important when I couldn't imagine a post fluidly. For example, during Yosh's last battle with Descartes which I asked, over skype, a bunch of questions about the attacks. Namely how high off the ground Raelis was hovering, where key things were, etc. Mostly to get a gist of the power, tactics and stuff that could be used even if my PCs don't have it. I like a challenge as long as there's some solutions.

<Snipped quote by Fallenreaper>

And this, ladies and gentlemen, is how you fight T1 style, without all your theoretical numbers.

P.S. I may or may not be drinking heavily tonight. While trying to respond to my NoW fight. Ha!

@Impaqt

Thank, I believe. I like to try to incorporate normal rp with arena style as it's a smoother transition than going purely arena. Earlier, I struggled so hard on Iron as I didn't have an actual story or world I could base him as well as being so rusty. Jacer's easier though I'm still iffy if I did him right or didn't put as much detail as I should. Mostly I have a habit that I put both strengths and weakness out front in a CS because it helps me feel better about the pc being balanced. Odd, likely, but true. XD Though Jacer is likely my most detailed one being at about 8 gdoc pages long and I've not even gotten into the back story and rp stuff really. >_<

Coruscant Sacked: Aftermath

~| Day 2, 7:57- 8:10 GST |~
~| Aboard the Kaggath, Main Prison Complex |~
~| Shiri & Xid |~

Xid was unnerved. His twitching fingers were held behind his back and his feet were restless, endlessly pacing a single path in his determination not to reveal anymore to the hidden cameras. The young knight kept his eyes bent down to examine the clear transparent floor underneath. The red tinted glass like floor inwardly created a mixture of emotions within him, one of awe thanks to the engineer within him. The other was of sickness due to the vertigo when he realized how high he was and his throat back felt the familiar burning sour taste collected there. It seemed like the unsettled stomach might win out over his awe when he abruptly jerked his head upward, prying his eyes away, and closed them. His feet came to a sudden halt at the same time, slowly dimming the effects of the sight on his mind. With a few deep breaths, Xid’s peakish coloring faded back to his normal shade.

Frustrated, mostly at the situation and Andri’s offer, he tried to ignore the growing guilt threatening to make him properly refuse the older Knight’s earlier offer. Why did everything have to depend so heavily on him? The question was one he knew the answer to but hated to accept it, Tolun’s words running circles within his head. In his absentminded, Xid plopped down near the lift entrance where he mumbled quietly to himself. “I’m not worth this trouble protecting.”

“Hey, there you are. May I speak with you a moment Xid?” Shiri asked as she walked up to the Knight. She had been trying to meditate, but she couldn’t focus very well with the oppressing presence of the dark side all around them. She was calmer for trying at least, but thinking about what she should say to Xid had her becoming flustered. She sat on the ground next to him and looked around the room as she waited for him to say something.

Xid’s head jerked up to see the young Twi’lek, Shiri, walking toward him. Her presence drew a smile from his teenage face as he moved over a little, pushing himself against the wall some, to allow her a spot beside him. Deep inside, some sixth sense would warn him of that door opening and another of the prisoners vanishing once again into the Sith’s influences. He briefly recalled his last secession among the Sith and shuddered slightly, reburying the moment away. He noticed she wasn’t looking at him when Shiri’s eyes panned the room as if looking for something causing his eyes to narrow in curiosity. “Sure, is something wrong? Did something happen?”

Once Shiri was sure they wouldn’t be overheard she turned to look Xid in the eye and held his gaze a moment before answering. “Yes, something happened, and I just want to say this so that you know, and can hold me to it. I’m not going to lie to you, ever. I feel that the best way for me to talk to you right now is honestly.” She was stalling a bit, she still didn’t know how to explain anything to him, but she did think being honest would help. “Should I start at the beginning?”

Xid looked confused for a moment, both at Shiri’s words and her actions. The latter looking more suspicious by the moment. Raising an eyebrow, his smiling had ceased as a concerned looked graced his expression while he looked her over. “I never considered you would Shiri. We’re friends after all and would never lie to each other so why would you think that?”

His tone, until he had said, sounded slightly hurt to his own ears. He nodded and leaned back into the wall while he wanted for her to continue. Xid’s face calm and relaxing, through his eyes were filled with worry and unnerved emotions at fearing his friend was in serious trouble.

Shiri sighed lightly and sat back against the wall. “No, it’s not that I think that really, I just wanted to remind you of exactly that before I told you this. Don’t look so worried, there’s something good I want to tell you as well. Two good things really.” She smiled and made a vague motion to the Turbolift beside them, lowering her voice as she spoke again. “Remember your idea about trying to escape? I was able to slice the lift in the medical room and get out for a little while. Of course that’s when things went really bad. I ran into a Sith, or rather, she just walked up behind me without me noticing.”

When Shiri mentioned she had escaped, Xid went deathly pale. His eyes widened in shock and a bit of surprise, his head struggling not to absorb the fact they could get past the elevator. The bad part, due to her running into a Sith meant the exit route could be compromised as well as Shiri being closely observed. This wasn’t good. However, Xid bit back his lip and kept his mouth shut while the Twi’lek continued. It wouldn’t matter to tell her how much of a risk she took or how she now placed a target on her back with this Sith’s attention, his ear perked for the rest of the information. It wasn’t fair to judge on only part of the facts and half statistics after all.

She raised her voice back to a normal level now, the only part she had really wanted to keep secret anyway was that she sliced a Turbolift. “So I went with her to what must've been their monitoring room, and she started…” Shiri looked back around the room once to buy herself some more time to come up with the right word. “Teasing, I believe she was teasing me, with you. She put up a still image from a camera of you blushing at Lea, and started saying a bunch of stuff to try and get me angry. I’m ashamed to say she succeeded.”

The Knight’s expression was once more twisted into confusion. He wasn’t sure why the image of him and Lea were shown by the Sith, but it wasn’t a surprise, at least in his mind, why he blushed. Sela even found it amusing that girls around his own age made him strangely aware of the oddest details like smell, looks and more. Things that shouldn’t matter to a Knight… but seemed to matter a lot to a teenage boy. His inner monologue was interrupted by Shiri’s next words.

“I wasn’t going to tell you this until we were safe again, away from the Sith and able to actually talk without worrying about being overheard.” Shiri smiled at Xid and pulled her lekku over her shoulder, unconsciously trailing her hands over them, the only sign that she was nervous. “Xid, I care about you, more than I care about anyone else, even more than myself. The thought of loosing you to someone or something makes me feel like I’m lost. I know, we only met some months ago, but I can’t deny the truth of how I feel.” She had to stop talking, to know his reaction, and she hoped with every fibre in her being that she hadn’t scared him with her confession.

Xid smiled a bit, believing he understood her confession. His hand reached out and gently took hers, pulling it close as he intertwined his fingers with hers. Blue, determines eyes looked at her with a kindness that was so characteristic of him. “You won’t lose me. The Sith won’t win, and we’re getting off the ship in one piece. I swear by the force nothing is going to happen to us as we’re Jedi after all. We’ll survive this. Through why did seeing Lea and me together make you anger? She was just helping me gather up the medical supplies I dropped into during my clumsy moment. I’m not the most graceful after all, don’t you know.”

Shiri felt her heart speed up as he took her hand, but as she realized he had nothing more to say she ended up taking her hand back from him for a moment and rolling her eyes. I’m in love with the most innocent guy ever. “Well, maybe you just need a stronger hint then.” She said quietly as she leaned towards him, cupping one hand around the back of his neck and holding his hand again with the other, closing her eyes before finally kissing him lightly and sweetly on the lips.

Xid literally frozen in shock when she planted a light, tender kiss on his lips. They tingled and seemed to come alive for a moment during the contact as her hand prevented him from jerking, in fear, away. For several seconds his mind was numb at what to do. Did he kiss back or resist it? This wasn’t the Jedi code but that didn’t keep it from feeling right while he relaxed, enjoying the moment. He found himself starting to kiss back when a noise caught his attention, causing him to break the kiss and snap to the source.

Arena Chat Thread

T1 isn't the best solution, but I also think that free form combat should be kept free form. Numbers just ruin the simple elegance. I think Skallagrim has some kind of rule set in his mind (or actually written and published that I just haven't found yet) that might fix this and might just need a little more peer review and testing before being able to be put out for the few of us who are actually here.

We're a small community though, so there are some unspoken rules which are pretty much just Arena etiquette; for instance, not being able to attack on the first post.

@Descartes

Sadly, that doesn't help newbies just popping in. I might've been mentored by Tearstone and Lyzan, but the later I forgot a bit of what I was taught as I never got to practice it.

Numbers are used to described the surrounding world same as words. To me, they have the same right to exist in a combat roleplay as a comparative description: saying that you can punch down a concrete wall is same to me as saying that your punch carries half a million joules in it.

@Vordak

I think we're talking more about Stat numbers than actual measurements. Those numbers, with a word description to give me an idea of how much damage that actually can do, help and make it easier to determine each other's strength and match up against each other. For example, I'm researching number Hz and such to get an idea of Jacer's enhanced ability as well as keeping it above human but not some "super beast"using an animal's range that slightly less than say a bat. Which from many resources is a very good listener. XP

Arena Chat Thread

I am not for stats myself, but some like having a number. To each their own.

@Skallagrim

I can see the perks, personally and simple math is no problem when you start adding math to it... if it's beyond basic math, I'm out. XD And yeah, though many go to tabletops for the number I thought.

Arena Chat Thread

Yeah, a format template with more carefully considered stat limits would be good for a fair tourny. Something interesting would be a base human template, with average strength speed and agility, and then the option to min-max on those stats, followed by a low level power.

Almost like a battle between DnD characters.

@MelonHead

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I was actually more interested in setting up a persistent Arena RP with a DnD style and the classic tavern. Where more human/med fantasy characters could fight it out and people could sign up to play monsters and stuff for groups to fight. I always thought it would be cool to go back to a lower tier more story driven narrative for a while, tone everything down as we're straying a little high for my personal tastes.

I'll probably never have time to do it though.

@MelonHead

I, personally, am not much for stats. The only rp I played that had stats was actually Kestrel's Library, where the most complicated aspect was determining your Pow, Spi, and Agi, which surprisingly limited bickering, snide comments or locker room drama. Mainly as had their perks and negatives, yet if your stats were lower than another PC or NPC, you couldn't avoid getting nailed or missing. Though coming up with the extra stuff was a pain in my ass. -_-

RPGuild Ranking Headquarters!

<Snipped quote by ImportantNobody>

In that specific case a member of their adventuring party, so technically a good guy, died.

@MelonHead

I take it the PC was another Player's or Rilla's? >_>

Arena Chat Thread

I'm back and forth on it. I actually wanna use a tournament where the characters fall into a format.

Element + Related Secondary Element + Weapon + Weapon Manipulation:

In other words, the theme I used for a good bit of the original resistance characters:

Trent: Earth/Metal/Staff: Can manipulate earth and metal, as well as the size and weight of the different staves he uses.

Jet: Wind/Smoke/Nunchaku: See Above

Levius: Water/Ice/Trident: See Above

Worren: Fire/Heat/Ninja Weapons: See Above

Derik: Electricity/Magnetism/Chains: See Above

There were others as well, I forget his name, but he manipulated plants and animals, and bladed tonfa.

For rookies, it'd be a good way to get involved and have a bit of practice, without shit getting all complicated with manipulating all kinds of other shit.

@Rilla

Simpler yes, but rather limiting. Not to mention there's only so many elements you can use before you start to repeat. A base line and good CS tamplate, that can be modified if needed, might much easier for newbies as most I see are just learning the ropes. Like myself. Not to mention, having closely formatted CSes might allow it be to be easier to compared stats and create a positive habit while still allowing creative freedom. Also, maybe a list of powers examples considered too powerful for the tourney level might also help newbies scale their creativity to the proper levels. At least know what might be considered a bad idea or request ideas of how to limit it down. Creativity is just as much as part of the arena as actual writing and balance, at least last I knew.